Give Brent a chance

[Ocko]

PR buying Sheffield was a huge balls up yes, but that was PR not Brent Pope. Plus, was that the reason we won nothing? Or was it Tylor Michel's farcical ban, or Stevie Lyle's error in the tent against the Steelers in OT. Who knows? What I do know is that we should of won the league and didn't.
I was a big fan of G and Franny, and I was sad to see them both go, but yes, I'd have that season down as the "Weller effect" more than anything else. Just my opinion.

Yes we are still eighth, but isn't that because of an awful start to the season, players not performing and being axed, Ross, Conboy etc. Lacosta having to retire. Not really coaching issues but PR saw that enough was enough and rung the changes. As the Stub said, probably the right decision to change, just not in the manner it was done. That's the beef people have right? PR is the owner, it's his club. Surely any wrong doings was him and not Pope?

Who advises PR on anything ice hockey related............
You telling me that the buying of another team, your closest rival, wouldnt have have had a demoralising effect on the dressing room.

Yes we did have an awful start to the season but we lost our starting netminder for the first 6/7 games ANY coach would have struggled with that especially when that is when players are still getting to know one another. G should have been given the same chances as Brent with the same financial backing to act as coach only but now we'll never know but it was G's recruiting that came up with the little gems like Michel McCrae and Weller.

We lost that season in the last few games against Sheffield because we weren't good enough. That wasn't to do with PR it was the coaching, it was the same Sheffield side we had beaten all year until then. If it wasn't the Weller effect, how well were we placed before his arrival? The player he replaced was arguably one of our better players (Sawyer) but we were still crap. That season was down to Weller, it's impossible to dispute that. His performances won us games single handedly and his coaching galvanised the whole team.

You mention 3 good gems but he also came up with gems like Hinks, Andderson, Ross, Milam, Dobben and many others. His recruitment is so overrated. It's pot luck in this country as we have no scouting. What about Popes recruitment? Signed a 'gem' in Kurka didn't he? Cook isn't too shabby and Joonas looks promising if he gets fit. Looks like we've improved coaching and recruitment! Adams also had no clue about European players, we signed one European player in his entire tenure and he was in the UK for years anyway.

It appears pope has a larger budget but in reality it isn't a great deal more than the old boys club G used to run. He wasted a huge portion of the budget on his good mate, 4th liner Phil Hill. He might have been able to sign another season changer like Kurka had he not wasted money.

 

[Ocko]

Seems like PR is laying the foundations for Brent to continue in the role for next season:

http://www.cardiffdevils.com/news/devil ... ly-review/

WD

At least it will make my decision on whether to renew my season ticket a lot easier.

As PR says "it isn't about liking the guy, it's about who can do the bloody job".

At the moment Brent is getting the results that Adams didn't. I really don't care about the supposed differences in support, the facts are the facts. (I'd have liked to see him have a chance behind the desk, but cest la vie).

For me, anyone but Adams going forward - even if it is a season of Pope.

? Still in eighth place and last in the conference

But the second best team in the league in December with arguably the hardest fixtures. We would have been looking a lot better had it not been for the mess Adams created.

 

[Ocko]

Not saying G was untouchable or any sort of messiah, but I would have liked to have seen him given the chance to coach from the bench rather than on the ice and with the full support of PR.

2008/09 season. G coached from the bench for the majority (all season bar 15 games at the tail end) until we had injuries and before injuries are blamed we were crap before and after the injuries.

 

[TheStub]

We lost that season in the last few games against Sheffield because we weren't good enough. That wasn't to do with PR it was the coaching, it was the same Sheffield side we had beaten all year until then. If it wasn't the Weller effect, how well were we placed before his arrival? The player he replaced was arguably one of our better players (Sawyer) but we were still crap. That season was down to Weller, it's impossible to dispute that. His performances won us games single handedly and his coaching galvanised the whole team.

You mention 3 good gems but he also came up with gems like Hinks, Andderson, Ross, Milam, Dobben and many others. His recruitment is so overrated. It's pot luck in this country as we have no scouting. What about Popes recruitment? Signed a 'gem' in Kurka didn't he? Cook isn't too shabby and Joonas looks promising if he gets fit. Looks like we've improved coaching and recruitment! Adams also had no clue about European players, we signed one European player in his entire tenure and he was in the UK for years anyway.

It appears pope has a larger budget but in reality it isn't a great deal more than the old boys club G used to run. He wasted a huge portion of the budget on his good mate, 4th liner Phil Hill. He might have been able to sign another season changer like Kurka had he not wasted money.

Exactly *nod*

But the second best team in the league in December with arguably the hardest fixtures. We would have been looking a lot better had it not been for the mess Adams created.

Great point. It may not be Pope but the "new coach spike", but we have been transformed.

2008/09 season. G coached from the bench for the majority (all season bar 15 games at the tail end) until we had injuries and before injuries are blamed we were crap before and after the injuries.

I'd forgotten about that. There was an improvement in results with G on the bench, but we still seemed to lack that tactical control from the bench.

 

[danhall76]

Was G not supported enough during his reign? How long was he given in terms of seasons? To some, too many perhaps?

The one year he was supported we went on a record breaking run and arguably should have won 2 trophies. If BP achieves that then maybe I'll revaluate.

The Weller effect maybe more so than G's coaching ability. After Weller signed, everybody seemed to up their game 25%. And your turn to hit the nail on the head. Should of won 2 trophies, but didn't win one.

no because someone elses interest turned towards buying sheffield.

It amazes me that the record breaking season people put it all down to Weller but when its suggested that the players are coaching the team now they are flamed then its all down to Pope.......

Sorry but we are still eighth

Why is it that we didn't win anything because of PR buying shuff? To win you have to be the best team and it would seem we weren't...

If for us to win the league Sheffield had to go out of business it wouldn't be worth it.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2

 

[toy_car_uk]

Re The club press releases relating to Hill/G/Pope/Kurka in summary.
Hills gone
G is going to the bench, with pope. we are looking for new player/s.
G is for filling his contract as Player Coach. We can not look for a player.
Pope is Coach we are looking for a player.
We have signed the highest paid player ever under Ragan (Kurka)
Some may see that as G being supported to the same extent as Pope?

Re Weller season, when did the winning run start and how many games did we play before Weller joined the team?

Re recent upturn in performance, Some times games are won and some times games are lost by the opposition. How many games in November/December were good games of hockey that you would like to watch again? I would say majority have been lost rather than won
While we have had moments or individuals that have been a pleasure to watch, I can not recall many games I would say that about.

G is part of the Devils history now, and it is horrendous the way the off ice organisation handled removing him. But this should not about be G or Pope, its about the Devils and its future. Right now the organisation needs to unite on ice, off ice and the fans. Ragan hints that Pope could be coach going forward if finances do not improve. Pope divides the fans, that is clear. Making Pope coach short term, along with how G was removed has driven some fans away. Long term making Pope coach will drive more away. How long will it take to replace the fans or draw them back? Is taking Popes time away from his MD role going to hurt finances further when he should be driving sponsorships, season ticket sales promoting the club etc? Not wishing anything bad, but what if Pope needs a lengthy time away for health or personal reasons? how would the club fill such a void? no MD no Coach?

 

[KaneDevils]

With sport, sentiment often gets in the way and clouds peoples judgement.
G was with us a long time and yes we liked him, he was a likeable man. But that's not enough in sport.
I think the beef is clearly how it was dealt with, not so much the choice to change the coach. And that's understandable.
However, we need to move on, G has gone now, so why not get behind the new set up and cast aside our love for our ex coach,
and the new ones hats, personality and anything else that isn't relevant and focus on what is.
Results & performances!

 

[jodysstillagirlsname]

But the second best team in the league in December with arguably the hardest fixtures. We would have been looking a lot better had it not been for the mess Adams created.

However to win things the only Stats that count are the tables.

Stats and the way they are presented (spun) can be used to prove whatever you choose EG 25% of accidents are caused by drunk drivers therefore 75% are caused by sober drivers. When I request stats in the course of my work I am asked 'What do you want to prove?'

Stats are a tool of politician's spin

 

[KaneDevils]

Stats are a tool of politician's spin

Shouldn't that read:
" Stats can be a tool of politicians spin " ?

The thread title is, give Brent a chance. I think comparing his tenure so far with drink driving accidents is a little premature perhaps?


WD

 

[jodysstillagirlsname]

Stats are a tool of politician's spin

Shouldn't that read:
" Stats can be a tool of politicians spin " ?

The thread title is, give Brent a chance. I think comparing his tenure so far with drink driving accidents is a little premature perhaps?


WD

No, it was just a very basic example of how stats can be used, you then add in that there are more sober drivers than drunk ones to get to a true outcome and a more accurate figure.

But you are right to add the can in

 

[KaneDevils]

you then add in that there are more sober drivers than drunk ones to get to a true outcome and a more accurate figure.

You can generally tell how good a player or coach is by stats though. The only real misleading stat in hockey is the +/-

Your example of driving accidents however differs as there can be many more factors as to the driver simply being drunk or sober. So your example is more misleading than accurate.

 

[jimmy snels]

But more to the point. The team are playing better than all season. We beat Sheffield and coventry over the xmas period and narrowly missed out to the chavs at home. The December results mean we're gaining on the teams in front. We had a 2000 attendance. We are playing aggressive competitive hockey. Its not constant dump and chase. We seem to try new things. Our young players are getting ice time not just getting splinters. Kurka is by far the best player iv seen since weller left. We have signed a netminder who wants to be here straight from college who looks great. We've entered the European hockey market.

In summary we've had LOADS of positives.

The only negatives a very small few still have is they don't get to have dinner with the coach and players, don't get the inside track on signings and goings on and are carrying on a personal dispute in public to the detriment of everyone in what can only be described as key board warriors attacking the club like rotten apples in a lovely bunch. Its been done to death the g subject. If your that hurt by it still and feel the need to be on twitter slagging off everything or on here putting negatives into every thread why not go to hockey anymore? No one wants you. The club sure as hell don't want you. Why not go support rugby or football if its so bad?

 

[martynh]

A big +1 to that

 

[DevilDom]

The only negatives a very small few still have is they don't get to have dinner with the coach and players, don't get the inside track on signings and goings on and are carrying on a personal dispute in public to the detriment of everyone in what can only be described as key board warriors attacking the club like rotten apples in a lovely bunch. Its been done to death the g subject. If your that hurt by it still and feel the need to be on twitter slagging off everything or on here putting negatives into every thread why not go to hockey anymore? No one wants you. The club sure as hell don't want you. Why not go support rugby or football if its so bad?

WD WD WD

Who do you count in the keyboard warrior category? Me? Toy Car? Jody? Wannabe? Sheincar? Paul Sulivan? I could go on and apologies if I've named anyone who didn't want to be named.

You are falling for the spin put out by PR - i.e. claiming there are only a few "keyboard warriors" as you put it unhappy with how the management have acted and continue to act. I can assure that there are a lot more people than that and if as you say they should they all went elsewhere the tent would be a lot emptier and I would imagine season ticket sales would be around 50% down.

The truth of the matter is that these people voice their opinions because they care and in a lot of cases have and continue to put a lot of time and money into the club. I would wager that a lot of the people that don't care about the backroom shennigans are those fans of a more casual nature.

The words from PR stating that he will review financials and not rule BP out of being coach next season sound like a veiled threat to me.

 

[mazza03]

Isn't it time to put all this to bed? It's done and dusted nothing is going to change the way any one feels so let's get on and support the team.

 

[jimmy snels]

The only negatives a very small few still have is they don't get to have dinner with the coach and players, don't get the inside track on signings and goings on and are carrying on a personal dispute in public to the detriment of everyone in what can only be described as key board warriors attacking the club like rotten apples in a lovely bunch. Its been done to death the g subject. If your that hurt by it still and feel the need to be on twitter slagging off everything or on here putting negatives into every thread why not go to hockey anymore? No one wants you. The club sure as hell don't want you. Why not go support rugby or football if its so bad?

WD WD WD

Who do you count in the keyboard warrior category? Me? Toy Car? Jody? Wannabe? Sheincar? Paul Sulivan? I could go on and apologies if I've named anyone who didn't want to be named.

You are falling for the spin put out by PR - i.e. claiming there are only a few "keyboard warriors" as you put it unhappy with how the management have acted and continue to act. I can assure that there are a lot more people than that and if as you say they should they all went elsewhere the tent would be a lot emptier and I would imagine season ticket sales would be around 50% down.

The truth of the matter is that these people voice their opinions because they care and in a lot of cases have and continue to put a lot of time and money into the club. I would wager that a lot of the people that don't care about the backroom shennigans are those fans of a more casual nature.

The words from PR stating that he will review financials and not rule BP out of being coach next season sound like a veiled threat to me.

Im not falling for anything. Im totally bored with the laborious posts of many of the people you have named tho. You are doing more harm than good now. You voiced your opinion (multiple times on almost every thread and we get it. You weren't happy with G going, paul being replaced and poor old phil hill getting the sack. I find it amazing how ever you do not dispute all the positives I mention and concentrate soul fully on bring negatives to the forefront AGAIN.

You really think 400 people will stop watching hockey because of this? Really?

Now I might be a sucker but iv enjoyed the hockey more in the last two months than the previousthree years!!! Thats what I pay for to be entertained. I couldn't give a monkeys about the rest and maybe concentrating on the hockey and nothing else might improve your own enjoyment?

 

[jodysstillagirlsname]

But more to the point. The team are playing better than all season. We beat Sheffield and coventry over the xmas period and narrowly missed out to the chavs at home. The December results mean we're gaining on the teams in front. We had a 2000 attendance. We are playing aggressive competitive hockey. Its not constant dump and chase. We seem to try new things. Our young players are getting ice time not just getting splinters. Kurka is by far the best player iv seen since weller left. We have signed a netminder who wants to be here straight from college who looks great. We've entered the European hockey market.

In summary we've had LOADS of positives.

The only negatives a very small few still have is they don't get to have dinner with the coach and players, don't get the inside track on signings and goings on and are carrying on a personal dispute in public to the detriment of everyone in what can only be described as key board warriors attacking the club like rotten apples in a lovely bunch. Its been done to death the g subject. If your that hurt by it still and feel the need to be on twitter slagging off everything or on here putting negatives into every thread why not go to hockey anymore? No one wants you. The club sure as hell don't want you. Why not go support rugby or football if its so bad?

Some one has to point out the negatives to encourage debate and to let this site continue as a forum rather than an arse licking message board, as in your post ' narrowly missed out to the chavs' = lost and for your information I have never had dinner or socialised with players or coaches, I no longer go to home games despite being one of the original SORAC members that ensured we had the tent and went on to ensure that there will be a home for ice sports in the city despite all of the negative comments relating to the outcome of that campaign.

We will have a home to be proud of and my only wish now is to have a club that will be run as a fit and proper organisation to go in to that facility, I don't really care if it is with the present owner/management set up or a new one. If everyone just keeps moving on, I don't see the current management learning any lessons and becoming an organisation that are fit for that.

The only financial difference in the new arena will be the number of seats and those still have to be filled. There are also things that the Club get now which they will not be entitled to in the new arena, there are some things they will get such as office space but that will be at market value rent. I really do not see that this new arena will be the answer to all of the financial problems like PR seems to think. It will only be viable if they fill those seats and taking fans and sponsors for granted is not the way to achieve this

 

[jodysstillagirlsname]

The only negatives a very small few still have is they don't get to have dinner with the coach and players, don't get the inside track on signings and goings on and are carrying on a personal dispute in public to the detriment of everyone in what can only be described as key board warriors attacking the club like rotten apples in a lovely bunch. Its been done to death the g subject. If your that hurt by it still and feel the need to be on twitter slagging off everything or on here putting negatives into every thread why not go to hockey anymore? No one wants you. The club sure as hell don't want you. Why not go support rugby or football if its so bad?

WD WD WD

Who do you count in the keyboard warrior category? Me? Toy Car? Jody? Wannabe? Sheincar? Paul Sulivan? I could go on and apologies if I've named anyone who didn't want to be named.

You are falling for the spin put out by PR - i.e. claiming there are only a few "keyboard warriors" as you put it unhappy with how the management have acted and continue to act. I can assure that there are a lot more people than that and if as you say they should they all went elsewhere the tent would be a lot emptier and I would imagine season ticket sales would be around 50% down.

The truth of the matter is that these people voice their opinions because they care and in a lot of cases have and continue to put a lot of time and money into the club. I would wager that a lot of the people that don't care about the backroom shennigans are those fans of a more casual nature.

The words from PR stating that he will review financials and not rule BP out of being coach next season sound like a veiled threat to me.

Just to point out the named are not true 'keyboard warriors' as they will discuss these issues face to face with the club, fans or management and don't just hide behind keyboards, everyone knows who we are

 

[DevilDom]

You really think 400 people will stop watching hockey because of this? Really?

I never said that. You said people that are still unhappy should go and watch another sport.

Now I might be a sucker but iv enjoyed the hockey more in the last two months than the previous three years!!! Thats what I pay for to be entertained. I couldn't give a monkeys about the rest and maybe concentrating on the hockey and nothing else might improve your own enjoyment?

I've enjoyed a couple of games over the last few months but to say those few games are better than the hockey seen over the past 3 years is pushing it a little IMO. The last home game was pretty poor as well. Perhaps if the management concentrated on managing the club in the best way possible and not so publicaly cocking up all the time then it would be easier for all to concentrate on the hockey. This is not just about G this is about all matters.

 

[jimmy snels]

Jodie:
Well iv watched the devils for years and years and have not a clue who any of the above listed people are other than paul sullivan who iv met briefly twice at the dj booth.
I congratulate you on the efforts you put in. I also understand the others mentioned put in their dues. Why this entitles the constant belittling of the new efforts being made and the positive hockey we are seeing I have no idea. Things are better to watch than before. We lost to coventry but it was close, we threw some hits and looked interested- something we didn't look like under G!!
Its ment to be a fun hobbie to watch the devils. Not a chore. You no longer attend games. That's sad. I hope I never feel like that. I think it helps by me not giving a rats ass about anything other than the game/potential signings/ hockey related stuff. Maybe if you take a break for the rest of this season then come back to aatch at the new areana but don't get involved with anything other than the game itself you can learn to enjoy the game again.