Parking cost rise

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#41
Clare said:
Unfortunately for the Devils organisation they are caught between a rock and a hard place in terms of finances and facilities.

Plans are in place for a new facility, hopefully arriving within the next two years. Therefore, despite the fact the current facility is a crumbling, dangerous mess, who in their right mind would willingly spend money on making it nice and lovely only to have it demolished again in 6-10 months time. (Let's for now, ignore the fact the current facility has stood a crumbling, dangerous mess for 7 years already and focus on the current plans).

Its very difficult as a business to look at spending money, when plans for replacement and refurbishment are all up in the air. Would you spend 2K on your car's MOT if you knew you were getting a brand new one for Christmas? Highly unlikely.

On the other hand, the current economy is having a crushing effect on many businesses, not least something like the notoriously non-profitable business of ice hockey. We are all being squeezed and we make decisions based around that. My view is that if you can't afford to have the luxury (and it is a luxury) of taking yourself and your family to the ice hockey, then simply do not go or make compromises i.e go once every three weeks instead of every two weeks.

The Devils organisation have clearly made a decision to keep the DCF running and to have junior and development teams (something that was looking like it was about to be thrown down the pan only a month or two ago). Within this decision, they need finances to continue. They seek to increase their income in order to produce a quality product for the future. To allow opportunities for children and young people to aspire and to grow. Its these types of organisations and charities that produce Olympic atheletes of the future and right now, that seems to be something very close to a lot of British people's hearts. I'm sure I am correct in saying that we as a fan base all want to have a quality product on the new ice pad in a few years time? We all want that competitive team? Hell, we all want it now. But now it is not sustainable. Plans must be conducted in achievable, baby steps otherwise we all fall into the mud together.

I'm not doubting the difficulty, and probably the sheer guilt they must be feeling (I know I would), at having to ask their fan base to contribute more financially towards a growing future when the facilities themselves are still waiting to be improved. BUT - they are a business, and this how businesses run. Generally, they have to generate more income before they can improve. You wouldn't re-decorate your house when you're already in debt would you? No, you'd wait, and save, until you could afford it.

I only hope that the new facility will be worth the wait, the hassle and the expense.

I would like the car parking fees clarified, as the £1 has always been a DONATION. Probably the easiest way of demonstrating a protest with regards to this is that every single person parks in Morrisons car park, leaving the rink car park totally empty. My point, don't complain and then bend over and get spanked willingly. There are other options.
Hi Clare, The other options also impact on the clubs finances, my point is I don't think it will increase the overall revenue as in there is only so much disposable income

Cut number
1) Away travel This won t affect the club financially but may have an impact on team morale
2) Snacks in Rink, Impact on PI take, may lead to increased ice time charge from PI
3) 50/50 tickets less sales impact on revenue
4) SOHB probably the biggest sole cash injection in to the Devils coffers
5) Programmes good saving which will more than cover the car park, but Sales of these dropping will have an impact on sponsors as this is where they advertise

It is easy to make savings to cover the car park and ticket increase but all of the measures will impact on the clubs revenue streams
 
#42
To be honest, I'm not really advocating either way with regards to whether people should or shouldn't use the rink car park, I'm just pointing out that for those of us who really take umbridge, there are other options. I agree that using the car park and paying a donation/charge will hopefully help the income for the DCF which I'm sure people don't want to lose especially in the coming few years.

I'd rather park in Morrisons, then walk round and drop a £1 in the boys hand. Income for the club, and safety for myself.

It's difficult to know where to apply price rises. An example such as programmes are already fairly high and as you say, sales are already falling, so they wouldn't want to increase them further. The parking is extremely cheap at the moment, so thats got the most area to apply a price rise to.
 

Earnie

Well-Known Member
#43
Another interesting thought is for the following season (2013/2014) when hopefully the new rink work is well in progress and the current car park is a building site or at least access to a building site?
 
#44
£1 has been very cheap,I've always paid it.
How many cars are normally parked on average? Perhaps the club should look to raise it to £3 but include in that price a 50/50 ticket and a shirt off his back ticket.50/50 is only normally around £100 so thats only 200 tickets sold,how many shirt off his back tickets do we sell on average?
 
#45
Brent has replied to my email requesting clarification around the "voluntary donation".

His response is that "It will cost £2 to park in the Cardiff Devils parking lot this season, the proceeds will go to the DCF."

I felt that was a little hedgy and not too clear with regards to whether the charge was still voluntary as it has been previously or whether we have no choice but to pay if we wanted to use that car park. His response is that the "Devil's car park users will be charged £2 this season."

Hope that makes it easier for everyone.

I wonder how many emails Brent has responded to asking the same question :shock: poor fella. I guess it probably would have made this whole thing easier if the "voluntary" option had never been! Although it seems lots of people believed it to be compulsory anyway as they would drive over the kerb and at speed past the boy to avoid paying :?
 
#47
To be honest, they can't legally charge anything to park your car on public land, hence the "Donation" bit.
I think a £1 donation, as we have been giving, is a great way to help the DCF. But for all of you that think £2 is going too far, then simply pay the £1 that you've always given, as surely a £1 donation is better than no donation at all??
I am sure that some will gladly donate £2, but just remember that its only a donation so its not really a problem is it?

The problem will come on days where there are swimming gala@s on the same day as the devils home games, all the people from the gala will not pay the £5 for the pool carpark and simply park in the rink carpark for free. When the people turn up to man the rink carpark, normally about 2hrs before the game, the carpark is going to be three quarters full already, forcing devils fans into the pool carpark @ £5 per car. Hardly fair???
 

Finny

Well-Known Member
#48
Gingers Husband said:
It is NOT The "Cardiff Devils parking lot" or the "Devils car park" How do they plan to enforce the charge?
Presumably they have got permission from the council/PI?

It's like when they hire out a venue - they don't own it but they charge people to go in.
 
#49
Gingers Husband said:
It is NOT The "Cardiff Devils parking lot" or the "Devils car park" How do they plan to enforce the charge?
Absolutely correct, its not the devils carpark,and they CANNOT insist on a fee to park there. If you feel strongly about it simply do not pay,but any donation will help th dcf.

They also have employ somebody licensed to collect money, if they have been given permission to charge.Anybody manning a carpark and collecting money HAS to be licensed by the SIA.
 
#50
Finny said:
Presumably they have got permission from the council/PI?

It's like when they hire out a venue - they don't own it but they charge people to go in.
They already charge people to get into the venue they are hiring though Mark. Using your logic they will be, in effect, charging £19 for a ticket.
As an aside, should you ever have a problem in the car park, try getting someone to take responsibility. You will find that no-one controls the car park, it's all down to the council.
 
#51
Gingers Husband said:
Finny said:
Presumably they have got permission from the council/PI?

It's like when they hire out a venue - they don't own it but they charge people to go in.
They already charge people to get into the venue they are hiring though Mark. Using your logic they will be, in effect, charging £19 for a ticket.
As an aside, should you ever have a problem in the car park, try getting someone to take responsibility. You will find that no-one controls the car park, it's all down to the council.
The carparking area, as its not down as a carpark, is owned by cardiff council. If you hire out a councl venue for an event, are you allowed to charge for parking?? Planet Ice are not allowed to charge for parking, as its not an official carpark (confirmed) so i really don't see how the devils can.

I still maintain that a "donation" is a great way for the dcf to raise funds though.
 

Kipper

Active Member
#52
houdini said:
I still maintain that a "donation" is a great way for the dcf to raise funds though.
The mystery though is what do the DCF do with the funds raised? Does it subsidise away travel for junior and NIHL teams? No. All transport has to be self-financing by the teams.

Does it cover ice rental for training? No. The players have to pay training fees to cover that.

Does it subsidise the NIHL teams? No. NIHL2 have to cover all their own costs through fees. NIHL1 also has to be self-financing and is Mark Cuddihy's responsibility.

Does it financially assist junior players towards attending conference or England trials and tournaments? Not that I am aware of.

I am led to believe that the DCF is charged a percentage of the Devils overheads in terms of office rental, stationery,heating and lighting etc etc.Perhaps this is where the money goes. :?

Funny kind of charity in my book.

I have personally spent a small fortune enabling my son to play through the junior system as have many other parents.I have also done my stint as a team manager and match night volunteer. It really grinds my gears that the charitable status enjoyed by the DCF is used as a vehicle for subsidising/offsetting other costs rather than helping to make hockey cheaper for players and parents.
 
#53
Kipper said:
houdini said:
I still maintain that a "donation" is a great way for the dcf to raise funds though.
The mystery though is what do the DCF do with the funds raised? Does it subsidise away travel for junior and NIHL teams? No. All transport has to be self-financing by the teams.

Does it cover ice rental for training? No. The players have to pay training fees to cover that.

Does it subsidise the NIHL teams? No. NIHL2 have to cover all their own costs through fees. NIHL1 also has to be self-financing and is Mark Cuddihy's responsibility.

Does it financially assist junior players towards attending conference or England trials and tournaments? Not that I am aware of.

I am led to believe that the DCF is charged a percentage of the Devils overheads in terms of office rental, stationery,heating and lighting etc etc.Perhaps this is where the money goes. :?

Funny kind of charity in my book.

I have personally spent a small fortune enabling my son to play through the junior system as have many other parents.I have also done my stint as a team manager and match night volunteer. It really grinds my gears that the charitable status enjoyed by the DCF is used as a vehicle for subsidising/offsetting other costs rather than helping to make hockey cheaper for players and parents.
Top post kip and straight to the point
 
#54
Re: Re: Parking cost rise

Kipper said:
houdini said:
I still maintain that a "donation" is a great way for the dcf to raise funds though.
The mystery though is what do the DCF do with the funds raised? Does it subsidise away travel for junior and NIHL teams? No. All transport has to be self-financing by the teams.

Does it cover ice rental for training? No. The players have to pay training fees to cover that.

Does it subsidise the NIHL teams? No. NIHL2 have to cover all their own costs through fees. NIHL1 also has to be self-financing and is Mark Cuddihy's responsibility.

Does it financially assist junior players towards attending conference or England trials and tournaments? Not that I am aware of.

I am led to believe that the DCF is charged a percentage of the Devils overheads in terms of office rental, stationery,heating and lighting etc etc.Perhaps this is where the money goes. :?

Funny kind of charity in my book.

I have personally spent a small fortune enabling my son to play through the junior system as have many other parents.I have also done my stint as a team manager and match night volunteer. It really grinds my gears that the charitable status enjoyed by the DCF is used as a vehicle for subsidising/offsetting other costs rather than helping to make hockey cheaper for players and parents.
I think your forgetting all the community work the devils have done as DCF which has helped build a relationship with the council. You can't claim to know all the costs involved in the set up and what it does and doesnt pay for unless you have access to their books. Do you kipper?

Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2
 
#55
Re: Re: Parking cost rise

nmase20 said:
I think your forgetting all the community work the devils have done as DCF which has helped build a relationship with the council. You can't claim to know all the costs involved in the set up and what it does and doesnt pay for unless you have access to their books. Do you kipper?

Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2
I think you are forgeting that one of the things the Devils scored lower than P.I. on during the original tender process for the new rink was their community based activities. Could you tell us what the DCF have actually done?

Sent from my kitchen using laptop & fingers
 

Kipper

Active Member
#56
Re: Re: Parking cost rise

nmase20 said:
Kipper said:
houdini said:
I still maintain that a "donation" is a great way for the dcf to raise funds though.
The mystery though is what do the DCF do with the funds raised? Does it subsidise away travel for junior and NIHL teams? No. All transport has to be self-financing by the teams.

Does it cover ice rental for training? No. The players have to pay training fees to cover that.

Does it subsidise the NIHL teams? No. NIHL2 have to cover all their own costs through fees. NIHL1 also has to be self-financing and is Mark Cuddihy's responsibility.

Does it financially assist junior players towards attending conference or England trials and tournaments? Not that I am aware of.

I am led to believe that the DCF is charged a percentage of the Devils overheads in terms of office rental, stationery,heating and lighting etc etc.Perhaps this is where the money goes. :?

Funny kind of charity in my book.

I have personally spent a small fortune enabling my son to play through the junior system as have many other parents.I have also done my stint as a team manager and match night volunteer. It really grinds my gears that the charitable status enjoyed by the DCF is used as a vehicle for subsidising/offsetting other costs rather than helping to make hockey cheaper for players and parents.
I think your forgetting all the community work the devils have done as DCF which has helped build a relationship with the council. You can't claim to know all the costs involved in the set up and what it does and doesnt pay for unless you have access to their books. Do you kipper?

Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2
How many people have had access to the DCF books since it was established? I didn't claim to know all the costs did I? What I do know is what it doesn't pay for, having spent last season collecting monthly fees, match fees, paying match officials etc. You tell me which parts of what I said above is untrue?
 

Sheincar

Well-Known Member
#57
Re: Re: Parking cost rise

nmase20 said:
Kipper said:
houdini said:
I still maintain that a "donation" is a great way for the dcf to raise funds though.
The mystery though is what do the DCF do with the funds raised? Does it subsidise away travel for junior and NIHL teams? No. All transport has to be self-financing by the teams.

Does it cover ice rental for training? No. The players have to pay training fees to cover that.

Does it subsidise the NIHL teams? No. NIHL2 have to cover all their own costs through fees. NIHL1 also has to be self-financing and is Mark Cuddihy's responsibility.

Does it financially assist junior players towards attending conference or England trials and tournaments? Not that I am aware of.

I am led to believe that the DCF is charged a percentage of the Devils overheads in terms of office rental, stationery,heating and lighting etc etc.Perhaps this is where the money goes. :?

Funny kind of charity in my book.

I have personally spent a small fortune enabling my son to play through the junior system as have many other parents.I have also done my stint as a team manager and match night volunteer. It really grinds my gears that the charitable status enjoyed by the DCF is used as a vehicle for subsidising/offsetting other costs rather than helping to make hockey cheaper for players and parents.
I think your forgetting all the community work the devils have done as DCF which has helped build a relationship with the council. You can't claim to know all the costs involved in the set up and what it does and doesnt pay for unless you have access to their books. Do you kipper?

Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2
http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/Sh ... ryNumber=0
 

Finny

Well-Known Member
#58
Kipper said:
I am led to believe that the DCF is charged a percentage of the Devils overheads in terms of office rental, stationery,heating and lighting etc etc.Perhaps this is where the money goes. :?
Is there anything wrong with that? I think Brent is still doing DCF stuff along with EIHL stuff so I don't see why it shouldn't take a percentage?

From the DCF newsletter, it's Admin costs are expected to be £73,600 for this season. That includes Wages, Rent, Accountancy, Trophies, Equipment, Playing Jerseys, Awards, DCF Schools Program-Flex Ticket Vouchers, Marketing, Heat & Light, Insurance, Tournaments, Storage Containers, Gifts etc.

Also from the newsletter, the money that is needed to be raised via Events, ENL1 Gates, Cardiff Devils 50/50 & Car Parking is £22,800 for the DCF to break even .
 

Paul Sullivan

Well-Known Member
#59
Sometimes I wish I was an accountant.

I am sure that costing £151,028 to generate a voluntary income of £45,568 whilst performing charitable activites to the cost of £11,604 would make more sense to me then.

If those figures mean IRL how they look then that's the kind if thing that clearly will reduce goodwill for the DCF and create the response to the Car Park cost that we have seen this week.

Even more so than the operation of the club, if people can see transparency they will react well.
 
#60
I can't help feeling that the club have yet again shot themselves in the foot. If they thought about it and said entry to the car park will be £5 which also gets you a programme, a 50/50 and a SOHB ticket as someone who stopped buying all three over two seasons ago I would have gone for it and I'm sure many others would have. If they expect a minimum of 300 cars the 50/50 prize starts at £150 before anyone gets in the tent, when was the last time it got over £100?
If they want to rethink I will volunteer to staple the tickets to the programmes.
 
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