My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and girls)

K

Kipper

Active Member
#141
#141
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

It's a question of balance of skill sets and attitudes in putting a team together.In my view you have to have team toughness in EIHL as it stands to have a chance of competing with the Giants, Panthers, Steelers. Otherwise we will be bullied every big game and I don't think the Devils fan base would tolerate that on the whole.

If we are going down the wholly European route because they are cheap and that's all the club can afford then say so.Just be honest about it.I would happily watch the team with 4 European imports in the EPL.I know that many wouldn't. Some of the best hockey I have seen has been played by the likes of Latvia and Slovenia and they have quality players.

We must realise where we are. It has been a pipe dream to expect the Devils to win trophies on our budget playing out of a tent.We have punched above our weight for years and created false hope by our competetiveness.

We have no right to expect to be up there with the Giants, Panthers and Steelers of this league.We are a bottom half of the table club that G and Franny managed to keep up the top half and getting to Playoff finals for years.

The club management will make whatever strategic decisions they need to make. Just be honest about your intentions and treat good and loyal servants with decency, respect and dignity.
 
Mooney#16

Mooney#16

Well-Known Member
#142
#142
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Well put Kip. A sound and reasoned man. I don't really want to pick anything out as respect your contribution to the Devils, youth teams and SORAC.

Just two things that I question. As far as I could tell Ragan said the intention is to change style a little to a quicker transition game and if that is via the use of European guys so be it. He is I would say actually saying they are trying to balance the squad. As far as I know not one person has mentioned going all euro player. That would be daft.

My other issue as you have said is you are prepared to watch EPP hockey. Surely via SORAC negotiating in a clause (I know you have left by then) that the free ice time package applies to a team playing in the top flight this had tied Ragans hands on this ever being a possibility. I can see the intention in the clause and the meaning but there is also a limitless hidden agenda in there that means the fans have essentially made sure no owner will consider dropping leagues. This was why I tried to get an explanation on that one specific clause as it seemed like outside pressure being exerted on to ownership.

That is by no means a pop at SORAC I make that clear. I will directl benefit from there hard work to continue to play this fine game and I'm massively grateful. That one small tit bit seemed like it stretched the remit a little.

Sorry to pick you up big man. Nothing but respect.
 
E

Earnie

Well-Known Member
#143
#143
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Kipper said:
It's a question of balance of skill sets and attitudes in putting a team together.In my view you have to have team toughness in EIHL as it stands to have a chance of competing with the Giants, Panthers, Steelers. Otherwise we will be bullied every big game and I don't think the Devils fan base would tolerate that on the whole.

If we are going down the wholly European route because they are cheap and that's all the club can afford then say so.Just be honest about it.I would happily watch the team with 4 European imports in the EPL.I know that many wouldn't. Some of the best hockey I have seen has been played by the likes of Latvia and Slovenia and they have quality players.

We must realise where we are. It has been a pipe dream to expect the Devils to win trophies on our budget playing out of a tent.We have punched above our weight for years and created false hope by our competetiveness.

We have no right to expect to be up there with the Giants, Panthers and Steelers of this league.We are a bottom half of the table club that G and Franny managed to keep up the top half and getting to Playoff finals for years.

The club management will make whatever strategic decisions they need to make. Just be honest about your intentions and treat good and loyal servants with decency, respect and dignity.
Click to expand...

Nice one Kipper - especially the last paragraph.
 
dave

dave

Well-Known Member
#144
#144
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Kipper said:
The club management will make whatever strategic decisions they need to make. Just be honest about your intentions and treat good and loyal servants with decency, respect and dignity.
Click to expand...
This is most of it for me.
Dave I believe the clause for ice time was also partly from the council and them wanting to support the highest level possible but I will check. Sorac had/has reps from all groups from the rink so I am not 100% on that as those finer details I was not part of.
 
Mooney#16

Mooney#16

Well-Known Member
#145
#145
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Ah right. That would explain a lot. Like I said didn't want to get caught having a pop just felt that tit bit needed explaining. Cheers bud.
 
K

Kipper

Active Member
#146
#146
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Thanks for the kind comments Dave. I haven't been involved with Sorac for a few years now as it has been led by the very capable Jody and Wannabe2.

You are correct though that the development agreement has a clause about a team playing at the highest level of hockey in the UK. I have seen that and that it says a team "currently the Cardiff Devils".

I have no idea whether PR can make the sums add up to ice a team capable of challenging for Elite league honours or not. It is his call as to what he thinks his customer base will buy into. No idea if the EPL route is viable as an option anyway. My understanding is that new teams have to place a substantial bond to enter that league as much as £70,000 I've heard. Would the fans support EPL? I have no idea.

As far as player origins are concerned I don't care where they come from as long as they give their best for the shirt.
 
K

Kipper

Active Member
#147
#147
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Sorry Dave lost my drift a bit then with one eye on rugby highlights.

As far as the clause is concerned I believe it was inserted to protect the Elite league position in the event that Planet Ice gained control of the new arena and wanted to take the team into the EPL. I am not 100% sure of that but it rings a bell. I am not aware of any agenda to hogtie the Devils management in particular but if that was the case I wouldn't necessarily have been in the loop.
 
Mooney#16

Mooney#16

Well-Known Member
#148
#148
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Thanks Kip. Thought there would be sound reasoning behind it somewhere. It just intrigued me the implications that specific clause might have on the future especially in the new rinks.
 
jodysstillagirlsname

jodysstillagirlsname

Well-Known Member
#149
#149
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Mooney#16 said:
Thanks Kip. Thought there would be sound reasoning behind it somewhere. It just intrigued me the implications that specific clause might have on the future especially in the new rinks.
Click to expand...

It will also benefit the operator/rink owners in getting bigger numbers because they will only be earning on the secondary spend. This will still require a competetive team playing entertaining hockey in the top flight
 
Mooney#16

Mooney#16

Well-Known Member
#150
#150
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Out of interest anyone know what Guildfords average attendance is playing in the second tier. I say that as a drop to the EPL would have to come with an associated drop in ticket price but would being a big fish in a smaller pond at a cheaper price bring more foot fall and increased secondary sales to the rink owner.
 
Mooney#16

Mooney#16

Well-Known Member
#151
#151
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

I realise that is all academic anyway really as let's be honest if that was my opinion I should have got more involved with SORAC and made a case at the time so I'm not saying anyone has got anything wrong just debating the EPL route and how it's not really open to the Devils.
 
Paul Sullivan

Paul Sullivan

Well-Known Member
#152
#152
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Bump.

Seems, as other topics that result in a debate that wanders are locked, it's worth resurrecting this one.

At one point some mods were moving posts to this topic but now it seems it's padlocks at dawn instead depending on your viewpoint / involvement / vested interest / friendship. (oh sorry, is it only critics of the 'outside' fans that are allowed to say such things?)

So - about that Conboy / Blight / Trolling debate? Hmmmm?
 
S

Sliput

Active Member
#153
#153
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Paul Sullivan said:
Bump.

Seems, as other topics that result in a debate that wanders are locked, it's worth resurrecting this one.

At one point some mods were moving posts to this topic but now it seems it's padlocks at dawn instead depending on your viewpoint / involvement / vested interest / friendship. (oh sorry, is it only critics of the 'outside' fans that are allowed to say such things?)

So - about that Conboy / Blight / Trolling debate? Hmmmm?
Click to expand...
I for one am glad that threads are getting locked. Posters such as yourself are hijacking threads to peddle out the same old stuff even when it has nothing to do with the subject of the thread. Yes , there are problems at the club but every now and again its nice to read something unrelated to that.
 
Finny

Finny

Well-Known Member
#155
#155
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Sliput said:
Paul Sullivan said:
Bump.

Seems, as other topics that result in a debate that wanders are locked, it's worth resurrecting this one.

At one point some mods were moving posts to this topic but now it seems it's padlocks at dawn instead depending on your viewpoint / involvement / vested interest / friendship. (oh sorry, is it only critics of the 'outside' fans that are allowed to say such things?)

So - about that Conboy / Blight / Trolling debate? Hmmmm?
Click to expand...
I for one am glad that threads are getting locked. Posters such as yourself are hijacking threads to peddle out the same old stuff even when it has nothing to do with the subject of the thread. Yes , there are problems at the club but every now and again its nice to read something unrelated to that.
Click to expand...
Fairly sure that Paul is big enough and ugly enough to reply for himself, but it should be pointed out that in the Blight thread it was taken off-topic by other posters.
If someone claims that Blight was disliked then it is only fair that someone should be allowed to post that they were very popular.

And whilst some posters might not like other people being negative, there is a lot of negativity amongst the fanbase at the moment. I'd much rather they air their views and give the club a chance to deal with it, instead of going quietly without a trace.
 
James

James

Administrator
#156
#156
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Finny said:
And whilst some posters might not like other people being negative, there is a lot of negativity amongst the fanbase at the moment. I'd much rather they air their views and give the club a chance to deal with it, instead of going quietly without a trace.
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Absolutely, the whole point of the forum is to discuss these things and the whole point of the inferno being independent is so we can allow these things to be said. We have in all fairness only had one attempt by the club to take control or influence the forum and that was by Matt Burge and Paul Sullivan. We do also however have lives outside the forum and cleaning and merging threads all the time takes a lot of time and effort. The Blight thread was locked as it was descending into a slanging match between 2 posters despite warnings.
 
O

Ocko

Well-Known Member
#158
#158
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

How can a fan be unprofessional?

I'd love to be a professional fan, where do I sign up?!
 
D

Devils advocate

New Member
#159
#159
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Ocko said:
How can a fan be unprofessional?

I'd love to be a professional fan, where do I sign up?!
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I'd love to be a professional fan too, but we pay our money and watch the game

there's way too much negativity now, it has genuinely spoiled this season for me, not just the club, but also the way a lot of people have conducted themselves on this forum
 
O

Ocko

Well-Known Member
#160
#160
Re: My Bumper Cardiff Devils debate thread for boys (and gir

Devils advocate said:
Ocko said:
How can a fan be unprofessional?

I'd love to be a professional fan, where do I sign up?!
Click to expand...
I'd love to be a professional fan too, but we pay our money and watch the game
Click to expand...
It would be like Man Utds designated 'singing section' because most of their fans cant speak English to join in the songs :lol:
 
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