Change in Import Rules for EIHL & other assorted crap

[Mooney#16]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

Precisely. Kids are incentivised to strive in those sports as there are rewards to be had for your efforts. Ice hockey has decided to try to drive down the finance towards British players and limit the available playing opportunities thus de incentivising the kids. Work hard. Get to the big league. Unfortunately the some total for your efforts will be pennies and a spot on the third line. That's not a career path any kid should and will entertain. It's a money ownership call.

I get that Simmsey is insinuating about EU employment laws and national classifications but they have retained the non EU limit. That's what I don't get. That had to drop to compensate for the change.

The reality is in three years time if the Devils still had Bowns in goal they would only need one skater to complete their lines. Who? Ritchie, Ben, Myers, Batch, CJ, Piggsie. One from six. Five guys potentially forced from the sport or resigned to life on a fourth line. What good is that to the future of this game. And where does any up and coming kid get his shot. There is nothing to strive for. It's gone.

 

[jester]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

Precisely. Kids are incentivised to strive in those sports as there are rewards to be had for your efforts. Ice hockey has decided to try to drive down the finance towards British players and limit the available playing opportunities thus de incentivising the kids. Work hard. Get to the big league. Unfortunately the some total for your efforts will be pennies and a spot on the third line. That's not a career path any kid should and will entertain. It's a money ownership call.

I get that Simmsey is insinuating about EU employment laws and national classifications but they have retained the non EU limit. That's what I don't get. That had to drop to compensate for the change.

The reality is in three years time if the Devils still had Bowns in goal they would only need one skater to complete their lines. Who? Ritchie, Ben, Myers, Batch, CJ, Piggsie. One from six. Five guys potentially forced from the sport or resigned to life on a fourth line. What good is that to the future of this game. And where does any up and coming kid get his shot. There is nothing to strive for. It's gone.

I think you missed my point, I wasnt agreeing you were right just pointing out other sports are no different.

If your a quality brit hockey youngster your sights SHOULD be set on the NHL or at least a top euro league not the EIHL.

If your good enough you'll make it, if this puts you off you wernt good enough. Harsh but true.

 

[Earnie]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

Who are these people who make these rules?
I could take a guess at one or two- but what are all the names. We're all the clubs represented.
It is a smack in the eye for the talented Brits and GB

 

[Mooney#16]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

Precisely. Kids are incentivised to strive in those sports as there are rewards to be had for your efforts. Ice hockey has decided to try to drive down the finance towards British players and limit the available playing opportunities thus de incentivising the kids. Work hard. Get to the big league. Unfortunately the some total for your efforts will be pennies and a spot on the third line. That's not a career path any kid should and will entertain. It's a money ownership call.

I get that Simmsey is insinuating about EU employment laws and national classifications but they have retained the non EU limit. That's what I don't get. That had to drop to compensate for the change.

The reality is in three years time if the Devils still had Bowns in goal they would only need one skater to complete their lines. Who? Ritchie, Ben, Myers, Batch, CJ, Piggsie. One from six. Five guys potentially forced from the sport or resigned to life on a fourth line. What good is that to the future of this game. And where does any up and coming kid get his shot. There is nothing to strive for. It's gone.

I think you missed my point, I wasnt agreeing you were right just pointing out other sports are no different.

If your a quality brit hockey youngster your sights SHOULD be set on the NHL or at least a top euro league not the EIHL.

If your good enough you'll make it, if this puts you off you wernt good enough. Harsh but true.

Other sports are very different. They can offer a career. EIHL now does not.

Brit youngsters will not make the show from within the UK system. But to make that system even more stunted makes that pipe dream even less obtainable. The show looks for players ready to play at between 18-22. After that you are pretty much done. So to get scouted out of the UK a kid would have to be entering and staring in the league at 18. So if he is being paid pennies and offered a spot on a fourth line how is his career ladder beneficial to development and growth. No kid just has natural ability to become an nhler. They have to work, train, develop and get lucky. So a British kid potentially good enough works hard, pays to train, has no career step avail to develop and is unlucky because imports have all the top line spots and specialty team places occupied and you will never be exposed to those situations so you cannot fulfil your potential and cannot get scouted to the show.

The EIHL should be step in British kids developments from as young an age as 18. This move does nothing to make that happen. The if you're good enough you'll make it tag. It's bull. You need talent yes. You also need luck and a chance. Neither of those two and your the best player in rec hockey. The lack of international ambition of the EIHL, EIHA, IHUK and a % of fan base is astounding. Growth of the sport lies at international level not some tin pot domestic league. It's just crass short term, short sighted turd polishing of the highest degree.

 

[jester]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

Precisely. Kids are incentivised to strive in those sports as there are rewards to be had for your efforts. Ice hockey has decided to try to drive down the finance towards British players and limit the available playing opportunities thus de incentivising the kids. Work hard. Get to the big league. Unfortunately the some total for your efforts will be pennies and a spot on the third line. That's not a career path any kid should and will entertain. It's a money ownership call.

I get that Simmsey is insinuating about EU employment laws and national classifications but they have retained the non EU limit. That's what I don't get. That had to drop to compensate for the change.

The reality is in three years time if the Devils still had Bowns in goal they would only need one skater to complete their lines. Who? Ritchie, Ben, Myers, Batch, CJ, Piggsie. One from six. Five guys potentially forced from the sport or resigned to life on a fourth line. What good is that to the future of this game. And where does any up and coming kid get his shot. There is nothing to strive for. It's gone.

I think you missed my point, I wasnt agreeing you were right just pointing out other sports are no different.

If your a quality brit hockey youngster your sights SHOULD be set on the NHL or at least a top euro league not the EIHL.

If your good enough you'll make it, if this puts you off you wernt good enough. Harsh but true.

Other sports are very different. They can offer a career. EIHL now does not.

Growth of the sport lies at international level not some tin pot domestic league. It's just crass short term, short sighted turd polishing of the highest degree.

Do they? only football and to a certain extent rugby will offer you a carear outside of the top league.

Anyone who beleives that Ice Hockey is anything more than a miority sport in the UK is kidding themselves and IMO dont ever beleive it will outgrow mainstream sports,
TBH if you said you played "hockey" to most people in the UK they would assume you meant on a pitch or astro turf.

 

[Mooney#16]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

And that is where I get my opinion from. I played international field hockey up to under 18 and then went on and played national senior league hockey. My time in junior coincided with the sport having a boom period following GB gold medal win at the Olympics. I saw first hand the finance, exposure, interest, sponsorship and growth raise exponentially of a minority sport linked solely to the fortunes of the national team. There is a domestic league. It's barely followed. But GB brought mainstream acceptance.

Now ice hockey which I've played twenty years also but to a shocking level is in a very similar state accept its spectator appeal and the game itself being an indoor sport lends itself to larger scales of growth. Not to trouble the big sports but to make itself self sustaining and competitive on a world stage. Not saying GB will ever win gold again but exposure gained from a competitive national team is worth more than any tinkering with the EIHL product. The owners believe they can make a league people will get interested in using imported talent leaving the GB kids and there development in their wake. They have got this strategy grossly wrong and it will fail.

 

[jester]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

And that is where I get my opinion from. I played international field hockey up to under 18 and then went on and played national senior league hockey. My time in junior coincided with the sport having a boom period following GB gold medal win at the Olympics. I saw first hand the finance, exposure, interest, sponsorship and growth raise exponentially of a minority sport linked solely to the fortunes of the national team. There is a domestic league. It's barely followed. But GB brought mainstream acceptance.

Now ice hockey which I've played twenty years also but to a shocking level is in a very similar state accept its spectator appeal and the game itself being an indoor sport lends itself to larger scales of growth. il.

Cant understand why more people dont watch ladies hockey :twisted:

However being a bit more serious, and i'm presuming your a bloke (apologies if wrong) Most hockey starts at school espcially for girls.

I think it being an indoor sport hampers it, as its not just indoors (an empty hall) and need Ice which equals cost.
(cold countries have numerous outdoor rinks and frozen ponds in the winter)

Also to play ice hockey isnt cheap due to the ammount of kit you need whereas hockey stick, ball bingo.

 

[jester]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

Just to add, these two links may help people realise why this decision has been made and TBH dosent go far enough.

http://www.lawinsport.com/articles/empl ... sh-players

http://www.philiplee.ie/Libraries/Publi ... .sflb.ashx

 

[Mooney#16]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

Slovenia has seven indoor rinks with the limited ice time that provides. They featured at the Olympics. Something succeeded there. How did they get a squad of that quality? That needs proper analysis from IHUK.

As for the links. I get the EU legislation and restrictions that have to be lifted but my major question would be why the non EU limit has been maintained. That cap is either enforceable or not irrespective of the number so if they had to make that EU passport recognition move what has prevented reducing the 11 to 8 graduated to compensate. Question not accusation.

 

[jester]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

The Non EU limit is also subject to legal challenge depending on certain circumstances.

As for Slovenia they may have fewer rinks but they can play outdoors in winter. If you look at it that way
Canada has more rugby clubs than Waleas and Ireland shouldnt they be better?

 

[Mooney#16]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

Maybe because Canadian kids have no upward progression within those country stunting growth into professional level. Same principle.

I'm afraid if the owners had genuine concern of the greater impact you don't even have to put it on paper. When so much of the league is under gentlemans agreement a simple board room decision of we will not exceed 8 non EU players is enough. The teams simply do not sign the guys. There is no problem. No player can have a legal challenge about not being signed by a team. This is a smoke screen of convenience to financial motivation and incorrect commercial strategy.

The crux seems to be people who believe a better EIHL will boost the sport v people who believe the national program will boost the sport. Myself I think the past is being forgotten and the owners mistake will lose a generation of kids to this sport. With the level of influence the owners have they should be far more responsible in their actions.

 

[oneill]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

Think it is a good move.

 

[KaneDevils]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

I don't. I agree with Mooney. This will have a catastrophic effect on British talent coming through, I'm afraid.
There's a reason Britain are mediocre in virtually everything. Apart from drinking and brawling in the street while vomiting. We're bloody great at that.

 

[kettdevil1]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

There's a reason Britain are mediocre in virtually everything.

Intrigued to know what the reason is.......

 

[KaneDevils]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

There's a reason Britain are mediocre in virtually everything.

Intrigued to know what the reason is.......

Have a think .......

 

[DevilDom]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

There's a reason Britain are mediocre in virtually everything.

Intrigued to know what the reason is.......

Have a think .......

I'm intrigued. Please enlighten us all with your wisdom.

 

[nmase20]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

I don't. I agree with Mooney. This will have a catastrophic effect on British talent coming through, I'm afraid.
There's a reason Britain are mediocre in virtually everything. Apart from drinking and brawling in the street while vomiting. We're bloody great at that.

wow, really? what a load of bull.
For a start the last olympic games would prove you completely wrong. For a relatively small island I would say we are good at a hell of a lot of things.

 

[DevilDom]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

I don't. I agree with Mooney. This will have a catastrophic effect on British talent coming through, I'm afraid.
There's a reason Britain are mediocre in virtually everything. Apart from drinking and brawling in the street while vomiting. We're bloody great at that.

wow, really? what a load of bull.
For a start the last olympic games would prove you completely wrong. For a relatively small island I would say we are good at a hell of a lot of things.

Exactly. 3rd in the medal table in 2012, following 4th in 2008.

I think I also remember seeing a table of number of gold medals per head of population which we were towards the top of.

I guess the rest of the world better start worrying if we can improve from being mediocre!

 

[KaneDevils]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

Sorry, I forgot how proud the Welsh are. I'll change British to English.

 

[chillee]

Re: Change in Import Rules for EIHL

This issue is one that can only really be sorted once Ice Hockey becomes more popular and widely known within communities. Players don't become good just by turning up every week and getting ice time, some natural ability needs to be shown and then developed from a young age and getting the best means expanding the sport, this I believe is achieved by the following.

I believe short term requires this change, young peeps need to come & watch and be inspired by quality games involving quality players showing skill and finesse, parents need to keep paying the entrance fees and feel their getting value for there hard earned cash, watching poor quality players fluff shots and basically mess up due to poor skills and ability is not going to inspire anybody other than the players mummies. Parents may well then become inspired, decide little Johnny has some skills on the ice, is dying to become the UK's version of Crosby and instead of wasting money on Man U kit, taking a punt on Hockey, getting little Johnny involved in a growing sport with a bright future maybe a clever option.

Otherwise the sport is simply a Sunday league waste of time, full of over weight wannabes.

Short term it probably is not great for current GB players, the same as the current crisis is not good for all employee's who cannot achieve the required productivity requirements of their jobs. But as with any sport, for people to grow they need to be surrounded by talent to learn off.