Surely Enough Is Enough

[Gaz G]

15 out of last 22 threads on here have been started or ended up in negativity towards the club that if I'm right in thinking, we all support?

Agreed, the last few weeks have been rough for us fans, the players and G and Franny.

I'm not in any manner saying that I agree with what has happened. What I am saying is that it has happened and we should leave it be. The releases made by the organisation seem pretty clear to me and no amount of moaning is going to change what has happened.

Again, I'm not saying I agree with what Paul Ragan has done but it has been done and again, nothing will change this. However, If Paul were to listen to everything being said on here, and decided, screw you all and walked away, where would we be? I don't imagine there are many other multi millionaires lining up to buy a business being run out of a blue tent with fans who whine more than my daughter when I tell her it's time for bed.

What I'm saying is, lets all just take a step back, have a breather and remember what we have been through and overcome in the past. Decisions have been made and they will stand, simple as that. No use moaning about it all the time as nothing will change.

Lets get a bit of positivity back on here and at the rink. Lets get behind the players and remind them why we are the best fans in the league. God knows they must be wondering what they are doing at the moment with all the changes, but lets give them a reason to come back next year.

The future at this point depends on the fans. If everyone walks away the business will have no money to invest for next season. If everyone keeps moaning on here (and before someone says it, of course the players look on here, whether current or potential players, it's a good tool).

We have a proud tradition down here and one we should be proud of. Lets focus on the future and not the past. Get a bit of positivity back on here and at the rink and wait for the good times to come again. Those times will come if we keep believing in our beloved team and don't walk away on years of tradition.

Lets make it happen guys.

 

[Skippy]

Well said.

 

[Earnie]

The 15 threads you mention achieved absolutely nothing other than letting off steam on emotive issues.

Support The Team and move on.

 

[drainage]

Couldn't agree more what's happened may not have been handled right , caused bad feeling and hardly showed us in a creditable light

That said it's done , all the tweets, bleats , posts etc are not changing anything now

I support the Cardiff Devils, it's a team not one man or even 2 or 3 men

I have met some fantastic friends, had some amazing away trips and watched good bad and indifferent hockey and long may that continue (although prefer the good hockey!!)

I want us to succeed I want us to be a club that people envy I want us to be proud to be Devils but most of all right now I want us to be united in the support of our club

 

[Ocko]

I agree with all the above posts.

 

[jodysstillagirlsname]

Yep lets go bury our heads in the sand yet again,it is just what they want and then they can carry on and treat all of the employees as they have G

 

[jodysstillagirlsname]

15 out of last 22 threads on here have been started or ended up in negativity towards the club that if I'm right in thinking, we all support?

Agreed, the last few weeks have been rough for us fans, the players and G and Franny.

I'm not in any manner saying that I agree with what has happened. What I am saying is that it has happened and we should leave it be. The releases made by the organisation seem pretty clear to me and no amount of moaning is going to change what has happened.

Again, I'm not saying I agree with what Paul Ragan has done but it has been done and again, nothing will change this. However, If Paul were to listen to everything being said on here, and decided, screw you all and walked away, where would we be? I don't imagine there are many other multi millionaires lining up to buy a business being run out of a blue tent with fans who whine more than my daughter when I tell her it's time for bed.

What I'm saying is, lets all just take a step back, have a breather and remember what we have been through and overcome in the past. Decisions have been made and they will stand, simple as that. No use moaning about it all the time as nothing will change.

Lets get a bit of positivity back on here and at the rink. Lets get behind the players and remind them why we are the best fans in the league. God knows they must be wondering what they are doing at the moment with all the changes, but lets give them a reason to come back next year.

The future at this point depends on the fans. If everyone walks away the business will have no money to invest for next season. If everyone keeps moaning on here (and before someone says it, of course the players look on here, whether current or potential players, it's a good tool).

We have a proud tradition down here and one we should be proud of. Lets focus on the future and not the past. Get a bit of positivity back on here and at the rink and wait for the good times to come again. Those times will come if we keep believing in our beloved team and don't walk away on years of tradition.

Lets make it happen guys.

Lets 'Go Forward' and forget all of the managements errors and scheming because it isnt helping the team duh the management haven't helped the team and you think we should cheer and give them free rein to continue to destroy the club

 

[Ocko]

Your two posts above Jody, sum up what is exactly wrong with our fanbase sometimes. I think you're starting to lose more supporters than gain them because it is clearly personal between you and PR. I think you're starting to look a bit childish now.

Unless you have a millionaire mate who is going to buy the club you are going to lose this battle.

 

[jodysstillagirlsname]

I think your two posts above Jody sum up what is exactly wrong with our fanbase sometimes. I think you're starting to lose more supporters than gain them because it is clearly person between you and PR. I think you're starting to look a bit childish now.

Unless you have a millionaire mate who is going to buy the club you are going to lose this battle.

Don't really care who loses the battle its the war I am concerned about. This club has gone downhill year on year since PR took charge and even more so since the purchase of Sheffield and the subsequent liquidation, maybe it is not wholly Paul Ragans fault and he has been advised poorly.

It is not my intention or need to gain supporters, it is the club that need supporters and by treating employees, sponsors and fans shabbily is not the way to achieve it. It also makes it more difficult for them to attract players that will attract fans to help build this club.

The club management need to admit their mistakes and bad judgements in order to MOVE FORWARD but all they do is tell all of you to move forward and you just accept it and for your info I have a few millionaire mates and I wouldn't advise any of them to bail Ragan out

 

[drainage]

I think your two posts above Jody sum up what is exactly wrong with our fanbase sometimes. I think you're starting to lose more supporters than gain them because it is clearly person between you and PR. I think you're starting to look a bit childish now.

Unless you have a millionaire mate who is going to buy the club you are going to lose this battle.

Don't really care who loses the battle its the war I am concerned about. This club has gone downhill year on year since PR took charge and even more so since the purchase of Sheffield and the subsequent liquidation, maybe it is not wholly Paul Ragans fault and he has been advised poorly.

It is not my intention or need to gain supporters, it is the club that need supporters and by treating employees, sponsors and fans shabbily is not the way to achieve it. It also makes it more difficult for them to attract players that will attract fans to help build this club.

The club management need to admit their mistakes and bad judgements in order to MOVE FORWARD but all they do is tell all of you to move forward and you just accept it and for your info I have a few millionaire mates and I wouldn't advise any of them to bail Ragan out

Sorry as a fan and adult I don't need you or anyone else to speak for me .... If I thought I was poorly treated I would say so I don't. By all means speak for how you feel but not for a fan base and certainly not for me

I don't think the G situation was handled well and am a big fan of G but he's one player and we have a team ..... I don't agree with everything that happened and don't necessarily like it but I refuse to bin 20 yrs plus of being a fan on this alone

Some comments from our "fans" are as much as fault as anything the club did ....and indeed are part of the reason we have other fans sitting knitting as the guillotine goes down , do they not get we are allowing people to mock us??.

At the end of the day Regan puts the money in its a business he has the right to run it we have the right to disagree and then decide to support or not .... I fail to see how taking a permanent stance against Regan Pope helps?

 

[Gaz G]

I think your two posts above Jody sum up what is exactly wrong with our fanbase sometimes. I think you're starting to lose more supporters than gain them because it is clearly person between you and PR. I think you're starting to look a bit childish now.

Unless you have a millionaire mate who is going to buy the club you are going to lose this battle.

Don't really care who loses the battle its the war I am concerned about. This club has gone downhill year on year since PR took charge and even more so since the purchase of Sheffield and the subsequent liquidation, maybe it is not wholly Paul Ragans fault and he has been advised poorly.

It is not my intention or need to gain supporters, it is the club that need supporters and by treating employees, sponsors and fans shabbily is not the way to achieve it. It also makes it more difficult for them to attract players that will attract fans to help build this club.

The club management need to admit their mistakes and bad judgements in order to MOVE FORWARD but all they do is tell all of you to move forward and you just accept it and for your info I have a few millionaire mates and I wouldn't advise any of them to bail Ragan out

The war????? Don't be so naïve. Everyone wants what is best for the Cardiff Devils as an organisation.

There are ways of dealing with things and ways you don't. Paul Ragan has made mistakes as has every other owner of every other sports club in the world. Do you think he wants to own a hockey club who don't make any money? Of course he doesn't. This club is finally being run as a business and by a bloke who whilst I hate to use the word again is naïve in doing so but will learn from it and wouldn't still be here if he was happy breaking even each year.

Out of interest, could you give examples of how we have gone "down hill" since he took over. By that I mean as an organisation that has moved on, secured a new rink and become financially viable?

Your point about it not being your intention,,,,refer to my initial post.

How is admitting mistakes going to solve anything other than people moaning and saying "I told you so".

Your final point about millionaires. Again, exactly my point.

 

[jimmy snels]

I think your two posts above Jody sum up what is exactly wrong with our fanbase sometimes. I think you're starting to lose more supporters than gain them because it is clearly person between you and PR. I think you're starting to look a bit childish now.

Unless you have a millionaire mate who is going to buy the club you are going to lose this battle.

Don't really care who loses the battle its the war I am concerned about. This club has gone downhill year on year since PR took charge and even more so since the purchase of Sheffield and the subsequent liquidation, maybe it is not wholly Paul Ragans fault and he has been advised poorly.

It is not my intention or need to gain supporters, it is the club that need supporters and by treating employees, sponsors and fans shabbily is not the way to achieve it. It also makes it more difficult for them to attract players that will attract fans to help build this club.

The club management need to admit their mistakes and bad judgements in order to MOVE FORWARD but all they do is tell all of you to move forward and you just accept it and for your info I have a few millionaire mates and I wouldn't advise any of them to bail Ragan out

You would be right in assuming it is personal id guess ocko. Id be interested to know if jody even goes to games since the start of the season? Or whether he just trolls on here on a personal vendetta to destroy anything devils because paul ragan is in charge? Im tired of him and at leasy three others. No one cares about their opinions anymore. Remember when juno used to post on here and we blanked him and he gave up posting? Im suggesting a similar approach. Send him to coventry so to speak.

I don't agree with everything that's happened but totally agree time to stop moaning and get back to enjoying watching the games. End of the day thats what we want to do aint it? Not get to see the contents of a players toilet?

 

[Slartibartfast]

15 out of last 22 threads on here have been started or ended up in negativity towards the club that if I'm right in thinking, we all support?

I think you can make that 16 now WD

 

[Foxy]

We'll just let them carry on until they've alienated everyone then. Then there wont be a team.

Ragan may be the man who puts in the money but he has no idea how to run or coach a team and until he butts out and lets the coach coach preferably not Poper then this season is going to carry on going downhill. We are the laughing stock of the league right now. So much for being a proud club.

 

[Ocko]

I wasn't asking how rich your mates down the golf club are, I was asking if you knew anyone who was willing to buy the club.

Why should the club admit their mistakes? They certainly don't owe me any apologies, I was unhappy how they treated G on a moral level but they certainly need not publicly apologise for that. That is their decision not mine or yours.

It just seems like you have to comment negatively on everything until you get your own way. What that is I don't know but it seems as if you expect the club to admit all their mistakes to you and beg for your forgiveness. And until then you will coral a load of bad feeling and support for your agenda. If you cared about the hockey that much you would be commenting on the good news that we have a new signing rather than the same old stuff you've been preaching for months.

Your comment about winning the war not the battle just shows to me that your real gripe is a personal one and not in the interests of the cardiff devils. You are looking like a spoilt child now, you are probably doing as much to damage the club now as Paul Ragan has done.

 

[Gaz G]

We'll just let them carry on until they've alienated everyone then. Then there wont be a team.

Correct. Better all find a chess team to moan about after that.

I'd love a go on the T.V show Room 101. After people spending 5 minutes at a cash point I'd put sports "fans"

 

[Paul Sullivan]

Helen that's a good post. I know you don't need me to tell you that either

I think it is right when people say there have been some darker sides to out fanbase emerging. However I would suggest that has happened to both those criticising the management and those who are critical of them.

For example - when Paul Ragan called a group of us 'militia' it was pretty much widely seen as a gaff, and poor judgement. Yet in this thread alone the same fans have been called 'Mafia' by a moderator and 'fans' (granted I am inferring you to mean those of us who have been outspoken and apologies if you did not) by yourself.

Whilst not the owners of the Club, that to me is no less disrespectful simply because we share opposing views, or outlooks on how to express them and highlight the need for change (of ownership or the style of it) on a Devils forum.

It's interesting that throughout the recent ineptitude (G saga, name-calling, the whole 'FACT' episode), there has been an element of the outspoken and angry supporters being seen as 'wrong'. It's not as simple as that really, but to gloss over the recent events, added to many additional ones where sponsors have been mistreated or lost, simply because one might be nervous of losing this brand of hockey is, for my money alone, wholly the wrong reasons to 'support the team'.

I completely respect everyone's position, I have never tried to get anyone else to say or comment anything from my viewpoint in this, and I understand that other supporters may not agree. However there is a laundry list of problems, growing almost daily, whereas on the other side we see one common argument, and it really does get distilled into the philosophy of a lot of PR's twitter activity:

'Real' fans wouldn't behave as I have.

Poppycock. Tell that to the MK Dons. Tell that to the people who raised the larger part of the £70k that the players were owed by Bob Phillips. That was done, and began by, noticing the cracks; the errors, the erratic and manic behaviours and the total disrespect for our Club and it's reputation. Not something that was done lightly then, or now.

If as PR has suggested there are only 20 who disagree with him then everyone can just tune out the noise and be happy that the 'Real' fans will be packing out the BBT like they did against Hull last Thursday.

Or we could accept that those on here, and indeed Twitter, do not represent the whole fanbase, however indicative, yet see the effect of the current regime's acts played out on the official attendance.

People are, and have been voting with their feet. Like hell do I think it's because of what I say on twitter or what, with respect, Jody says on here. They are intelligent fans who have made their own minds up to not buy a ticket or, in some extreme cases, cancel the ST they already have.

That is a massive judgement call, and I defy anyone to call, for example, Mandy Bates out for not being a 'Real' fan.

This doesn't have to come down to fan vs fan, however opposed the views are on this matter. And please don't take this post as being aimed in any way at you personally, I just picked up on that one aspect of your post to begin.

Those of us who are opposed to the way Brent and Paul are managing the club are no more some rabid militia than those who choose to support them are mindless drones without the ability to make their own decisions. It is only the Clubs style of communication that positions us in such a manner.

Just because you love something doesn't mean you can't be critical of it. Especially when 'it' is bigger than any of us, any owner or MD, Coach or anyone else. There is a common misconception that I often see repeated. That this is about Paul or Brent. No. It's about the Cardiff Devils, and what they are doing to that name.

Our views on that don't warrant marginalisation as a militant group any more than anyone else's views should have them labelled as 'happy clappers'. This is a subtle and complex situation with nuance and layers. It's not simply 'right' and 'wrong'.

As for the OP's question - I wholeheartedly agree with you that enough is enough. But not the difference of opinions - the decisions that have brought us here. Nothing in our recent history indicates things will be any better in the future, We have devolved as an organisation in this Calendar year at an alarming rate.

Sorry for the long post.

 

[thunder_rd]

15 out of last 22 threads on here have been started or ended up in negativity towards the club that if I'm right in thinking, we all support?

Agreed, the last few weeks have been rough for us fans, the players and G and Franny.

I'm not in any manner saying that I agree with what has happened. What I am saying is that it has happened and we should leave it be. The releases made by the organisation seem pretty clear to me and no amount of moaning is going to change what has happened.

Again, I'm not saying I agree with what Paul Ragan has done but it has been done and again, nothing will change this. However, If Paul were to listen to everything being said on here, and decided, screw you all and walked away, where would we be? I don't imagine there are many other multi millionaires lining up to buy a business being run out of a blue tent with fans who whine more than my daughter when I tell her it's time for bed.

What I'm saying is, lets all just take a step back, have a breather and remember what we have been through and overcome in the past. Decisions have been made and they will stand, simple as that. No use moaning about it all the time as nothing will change.

Lets get a bit of positivity back on here and at the rink. Lets get behind the players and remind them why we are the best fans in the league. God knows they must be wondering what they are doing at the moment with all the changes, but lets give them a reason to come back next year.

The future at this point depends on the fans. If everyone walks away the business will have no money to invest for next season. If everyone keeps moaning on here (and before someone says it, of course the players look on here, whether current or potential players, it's a good tool).

We have a proud tradition down here and one we should be proud of. Lets focus on the future and not the past. Get a bit of positivity back on here and at the rink and wait for the good times to come again. Those times will come if we keep believing in our beloved team and don't walk away on years of tradition.

Lets make it happen guys.

Lets 'Go Forward' and forget all of the managements errors and scheming because it isnt helping the team duh the management haven't helped the team and you think we should cheer and give them free rein to continue to destroy the club

Totally agree with this thread.
It's frankly amazing that no matter what, within a couple of replies, jodysstillagirlsname has to inject a negative.
Read the post again.
Doesn't say cheer the management!
Doesn't say give them free reign to miss manage the club.
What he doe ask is that Fan get behind the Team.
I wonder just how many poster on here actually go to a game?
This forum is getting toxic.
No it is toxic.
What miffs me is the Guys go away and win on Saturday, narrowly miss doing the double. Play well and the forum goes to meltdown totally unrelated I know.
You have encouraged the trolls to come out of the wood work and they are loving it.
READ THE POST AND CONTEMPLATE THE REQUEST
RIGHT BEHIND YOU GAZ G

 

[Chris]

For example - when Paul Ragan called a group of us 'militia' it was pretty much widely seen as a gaff, and poor judgement. Yet in this thread alone the same fans have been called 'Mafia' by a moderator and 'fans' (granted I am inferring you to mean those of us who have been outspoken and apologies if you did not) by yourself.

Militia, that's the word I was looking for!

I'll edit my post now I know the correct term

 

[nmase20]

oh another thread on this, thats exactly what we needed. I was thinking we were running a bit low.... seriously this could of been said on any one of the other threads. instead by trying to say enough is enough you've just added fuel.