Current ice pad.
- Thread starter HockeyGirl123
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Hey I am happy to disagree with you that is what a forum is all about, voicing opinions. When PI prove me wrong I will admit it( if I am still alive ) as I said earlier I would love them to prove me wrong as then SORAC have achieved what it set out to do. Even Mr Neville of PI knows I don t take things personally, its not in my nature
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#27
Very good points, what's annoying is that PI say that their the biggest ice rink company in Europe and they have a lot of teams in the Elite League within their rinks. Yet there still willing to let a player risk injury to play. To be honest I think it's best the ice be sorted out sooner rather than later when we have a few injured players out on the sidelines. It was appauling on Saturday and rather embarrising to watch them fix the ice 4 times!! Surely that is enough evidence for PI to sort out the ice pad. It's not just the hockey players that are risking injury, any member of the public can easily hurt themselfs skating on there. Just seems like they want to make as much money as possible and that they don't really care.
The ice normally gets re-done a couple of weeks into the season, once the sponsors are confirmed.
Although, as with many people pointing this out already, thats no excuse for having not done it at the end of last season. Its not like the ice pad isnt used in the off season.
I've got an idea. It requires someone willing to go skating, fall badly, break several bones that will result in them taking time off work and then sue the bar stewards at PI for injury.
If no one is willing to do that, I suggest that the fans have a "mass complaint" with a threat to boycott the use of the rink until the pad is made safe.
Although, as with many people pointing this out already, thats no excuse for having not done it at the end of last season. Its not like the ice pad isnt used in the off season.
I've got an idea. It requires someone willing to go skating, fall badly, break several bones that will result in them taking time off work and then sue the bar stewards at PI for injury.
If no one is willing to do that, I suggest that the fans have a "mass complaint" with a threat to boycott the use of the rink until the pad is made safe.
The primary issue seems to be that planet ice are responsible for the safety of any individual using their facilities, if they are not maintaining the rink to acceptable levels then they are at fault whether you a fan of PI or not (and its fair to say there is a reason the majority are not) the sponsor sign is neither here nor there from my perspective, I'm completely agreeable to waiting until there is a lull in business from school restarting for that because I want the rink to be a success no matter who runs it. I can not however understand why anyone would think it is in anyway acceptable to have the ice in poor condition, regardless of who made what decisions regarding a game being played on it, PI would agree as it makes them money, the devils would agree as they have a responsibility to their fans and need to get playing to get used to playing together. But poor ice is poor ice, and should never be the case in an ice rink run by Europe's alleged largest ice rink operator, a business of such magnitude should know better.
I've been reading this thread as a guest for a while now and, while there are some beyond-ludicrous postings on here, this one has a sense of balance to it so I thought I'd take the time to register and reply. To begin with, nobody thinks it's acceptable to have the ice in poor condition. As an ice rink business it's only logical to want to have the ice in a good quality, usable condition. As someone stated earlier, the plant had failed on that day during the public session, meaning you end up with a lot of water on the ice. To slow the speed at which the ice melts, you need to dry-cut the ice (lay no water) to get rid of the standing surface water which is increasing the load on the plant and heating the ice below it. The flip-side to the coin is that the level of the ice can drop significantly and (in the case of Cardiff) you can get small patches where the sand is close to coming through the ice. When the ice is in this condition before a game, it's down to the Referee to liaise with both sets of Coaches and decide if it's safe for the game to go ahead. Ultimately the decision should be a Health and Safety one, not a financial one and all three must agree. In this instance I can only assume all parties agreed to play which is why it went ahead in the first place.
The size of Planet Ice will have nothing to do with the ice failing and is very much irrelevant here. Plant equipment failure can happen at any time, anywhere. If you apply the yardstick of 'big business = infallible plant' then I'm at a loss to explain how the Phoenix Coyotes had to cancel a game 2-3 years back due to their plant failing and one compressor not keeping up with the outside temperature :shock: It's not a maintenance issue either - while not going into details, I know there is a maintenance contract in place with a specialist company, as well as general maintenance being carried out by the on-site staff. I also know the Cardiff staff are probably the most technically gifted when it comes to ice plant management, due to having a strong leadership in that area.
I'm in no way involved in Cardiff so can't speak on behalf of anybody, however I think it's a little unreasonable to play judge, jury and executioner when there's very little appreciation of what happened on the day and how little could be done to prevent it. To imply that nobody cares about the state of the ice as long as money is being made (not by the person I'm quoting I hasten to add) is insulting to the staff there, who I know take a great deal of pride in their work. To go a step further, in the General Manager there you have one of the most experienced and knowledgeable people in the UK as far as sand-based ice pads go - he wouldn't allow for the ice to get that bad through human error either directly or indirectly, but even he can't magically fix failed equipment!
Now, where's Finny to savage my post?........ :lol:
The size of Planet Ice will have nothing to do with the ice failing and is very much irrelevant here. Plant equipment failure can happen at any time, anywhere. If you apply the yardstick of 'big business = infallible plant' then I'm at a loss to explain how the Phoenix Coyotes had to cancel a game 2-3 years back due to their plant failing and one compressor not keeping up with the outside temperature :shock: It's not a maintenance issue either - while not going into details, I know there is a maintenance contract in place with a specialist company, as well as general maintenance being carried out by the on-site staff. I also know the Cardiff staff are probably the most technically gifted when it comes to ice plant management, due to having a strong leadership in that area.
I'm in no way involved in Cardiff so can't speak on behalf of anybody, however I think it's a little unreasonable to play judge, jury and executioner when there's very little appreciation of what happened on the day and how little could be done to prevent it. To imply that nobody cares about the state of the ice as long as money is being made (not by the person I'm quoting I hasten to add) is insulting to the staff there, who I know take a great deal of pride in their work. To go a step further, in the General Manager there you have one of the most experienced and knowledgeable people in the UK as far as sand-based ice pads go - he wouldn't allow for the ice to get that bad through human error either directly or indirectly, but even he can't magically fix failed equipment!
Now, where's Finny to savage my post?........ :lol:
I think the essential problem isn't the ice pad directly, but rather the "and all the issues with the ice". The general feeling of the rink is poor reinvestment and general delapidation.
If this was the only issue, or the only issue we have seen with the ice equipment, then people would probably more accepting.
If this was the only issue, or the only issue we have seen with the ice equipment, then people would probably more accepting.
I think it may have been his night off though as when he wasn't outside smoking he was quality testing the wares on offer at the bar. No sign of him near the ice.
On a more serious note chris, what stops any rink relaying the ice and painting the white /lines/hash marks etc. at the end of the season and then adding the sponsors logos after the school holidays? Would this be workable or would the whole pad have to be taken up twice.
On a more serious note chris, what stops any rink relaying the ice and painting the white /lines/hash marks etc. at the end of the season and then adding the sponsors logos after the school holidays? Would this be workable or would the whole pad have to be taken up twice.
The temperatures are similar - it's just the wind chill from the bay! :lol: Seriously, the Phoenix plant is obviously far more powerful as it's designed to deal with those temperatures. My point was that the equipment can fail and the ice can go to pot even at the highest level. This is a rink where they have 8 hours plus of pure maintenance per day, but when disaster hits it counts for nothing.
Even if it was Chris's night off I can't imagine he didn't look at the problem anyway. I'll wager that it was a case of 'grin and bear it' as nothing could be done until the plant was fixed.
To answer your question reference relaying the pad, I'd imagine it wasn't financially viable to look at doing it twice. It's possible to put small logos into the pad after relaying, though it leaves that area of the pad vulnerable for about a week and is not ideal to do. Plus Devils aren't exactly the kind of organisation to just sell one or two small logos, meaning it's likely you'd end up with half of the pad out of commission. In that environment it's best to wait and do it in one go.
To address James' point, the staff have control of maintenance and what goes on in each building. The only reason they'd be frustrated is if the problem is out of their control - as it was in this case.
Even if it was Chris's night off I can't imagine he didn't look at the problem anyway. I'll wager that it was a case of 'grin and bear it' as nothing could be done until the plant was fixed.
To answer your question reference relaying the pad, I'd imagine it wasn't financially viable to look at doing it twice. It's possible to put small logos into the pad after relaying, though it leaves that area of the pad vulnerable for about a week and is not ideal to do. Plus Devils aren't exactly the kind of organisation to just sell one or two small logos, meaning it's likely you'd end up with half of the pad out of commission. In that environment it's best to wait and do it in one go.
To address James' point, the staff have control of maintenance and what goes on in each building. The only reason they'd be frustrated is if the problem is out of their control - as it was in this case.
From a purely business perspective, Planet Ice are the rink operator and therefore responsible for the health of safety of those using the rink. This includes the Devils, their opposition and all the other users of the ice pad - not least the public session skaters.
At present, the concern isn't whether the ice pad has the right logos, but rather the risk of serious injury that is run with painfully thin ice, gaps between ice and bottom of boards that are deep enough to hide a puck (or more importantly, to jam a hire skate in and cause serious injury) and damaged boards that run risk of injury.
It's one thing to live with faded markings on the ice. It's a totally different thing to run a rink, putting your customers at risk.
At present, the concern isn't whether the ice pad has the right logos, but rather the risk of serious injury that is run with painfully thin ice, gaps between ice and bottom of boards that are deep enough to hide a puck (or more importantly, to jam a hire skate in and cause serious injury) and damaged boards that run risk of injury.
It's one thing to live with faded markings on the ice. It's a totally different thing to run a rink, putting your customers at risk.
Lucas 69; As you've quoted me I have to say you are quite right about the state of the ice - repeating what many others have said. the point I have made, which perhaps you'd like to offer a response - is that PI. Gerad (representing the Devils) and the referee on the night were consulted about the ice. Now, surely if they did not think a game should be played, they wouldn't have done so would they ? There's no doubt issues have to be addressed, but lets at least give PI a chance to sort out the problems with plant, and see if there is a positive improvement for the Belfast game eh. If not, I will join the chorus of those demanding something should be done, until then, I'm prepared to accept that it was glitch on the day