EIHL what needs fixing?

moggy#9

Well-Known Member
Thread starter #1
Without touching on what happened on last night, there are clearly some things with the way the league is run that aren't great. The obvious ones are things like the 19 player rule and (until recently) the lack of streaming by some clubs.

I'd also add the league management and the challenge cup.

What do other people think the league needs to sort out?
 

Hedd Wyn John

Well-Known Member
#5
Simple….. owners running the league and owning more than one team.
An Independent chairperson needed badly to oversee major decisions including calibrating DOPS reviews and suspensions.

And move Dave Simms as far away from it as possible.
Nail on head.

Too much conflict of interest going on.
 

Hedd Wyn John

Well-Known Member
#7
Clearly the flip side of that coin is that its because of them we have a league in the first place but time to hand over the reigns .
Well thats the issue isn't it. The UK hockey world is small so you haven't got a huge pool to draw investors, funding & officials from.

The key thing is Where's the succession planning? What happens when key people in the league get too old, Where's the development? Where's the programme?
 

august04 2.0

Well-Known Member
#8
You’re not going to get much change, too much self interest with the team owners. To start with, the officiating has to be better and I include DOPS in that. Time and time again, we see some baffling decisions which appear to favour the big boys too. Nothing changes though and I think it’s gone backwards if anything this year. The on ice officiating is very poor, some of them don’t even look fit enough. We've seen it every week in Cardiff just about, officials who are not up to scratch, my God they couldn’t even turn up on time the other day and Hicks had to lace them up for the first time in 10 years or whatever it was. It’s so unprofessional. We can’t seem to develop our own officials to the necessary standard so we have to import them. I’d even accept teams playing with one import less (when we're back up to full rosters next year hopefully), and use the savings from each team playing with one less import, to fund 4 or 5 refs of decent standard. There was that Czech guy a few years ago, can’t remember his name (Smejkal?). Guys like him, I thought he was head and shoulders above the current pool.
 

tim78

Active Member
#9
Sorry to go against the thread. I don't think the league is that bad, but last night's decision was well beyond a misjudged call.

Its the exact opposite of what video review was brought in for.
 

Mazzoak

Well-Known Member
#11
More teams, more fans, more money then officials and quality will follow, just as with players. Until then no chance, refs are no different to players, they go where their talent & money will take them.
 

moggy#9

Well-Known Member
Thread starter #12
More teams, more fans, more money then officials and quality will follow, just as with players. Until then no chance, refs are no different to players, they go where their talent & money will take them.
Again, all fair comments and fine objectives. But how does the league achieve those things. Short of partnering subscribed to build more rinks, where will more teams come from? Encourage teams into arenas? Get maybe Leeds in? Find new ownership in Edinburgh? Invite teams from France, the Netherlands or Denmark to join?

I'm not having a poke at you, I'm just saying that there needs to be a plan to get where we want to be.
 

Mazzoak

Well-Known Member
#13
Again, all fair comments and fine objectives. But how does the league achieve those things. Short of partnering subscribed to build more rinks, where will more teams come from? Encourage teams into arenas? Get maybe Leeds in? Find new ownership in Edinburgh? Invite teams from France, the Netherlands or Denmark to join?

I'm not having a poke at you, I'm just saying that there needs to be a plan to get where we want to be.
Who is we ?

The fans, their limited in numbers, the owners, they must be happy, take ours, on another thread it’s estimated per game the owners are at a loss of £40,000 per game. Take out costs that’s got to be a good guesstimate of £15,000 to £20,000 into the owners bank, thats not bad. How many other clubs are in that position & are they willing to stump up more funds to promote Ice Hockey.
Then there is Climate Change, energy costs will continue to massively increase, building more rinks become less and less viable.
Its catch 22, you need a large fan base to make business people want to invest, without that its a punt, a high risk punt. What U.K. hockey needs is what Cardiff has, and I’m afraid that’s unique and very highly unlikely in the future. How long will hockey last in the U.K. ?????
What we need is the EIHL to become part of Hockey Europe, it needs to be independent and professional and this will need a large financial commitment from U.K. clubs and will never happen. Owners are happy to take the profit and continue as is. The ones with ambition will be looking into European Club opportunities......
 

rolf

Active Member
#14
The clue here is in the title of this thread. The answer is nothing as long as you can afford to buy some officials....why waste money on team recruitment when you can buy a few refs and the dops guys? Job done! Maybe 6 phone calls. No cvs. Simples)))))
 

Mazzoak

Well-Known Member
#16
The clue here is in the title of this thread. The answer is nothing as long as you can afford to buy some officials....why waste money on team recruitment when you can buy a few refs and the dops guys? Job done! Maybe 6 phone calls. No cvs. Simples)))))
Or you just spread £30,000 between a hundred false individuals to bet on your favourite team..........not that I’m suggesting anyone involved in running the EIHL would ever match fix a game.
 

Johnnybravo1927

Well-Known Member
#17
Won't be a popular opinion but....Have a max of 4 overseas imports and invest in our youth. Also set up some proper training academies for players and for referees. Initially the standard will drop but within a few years that would change. Would also allow us to bring in decent quality imports as there are sometimes players who come over to the UK and are expected to be good purely because they are Canadians
 

moggy#9

Well-Known Member
Thread starter #18
Won't be a popular opinion but....Have a max of 4 overseas imports and invest in our youth. Also set up some proper training academies for players and for referees. Initially the standard will drop but within a few years that would change. Would also allow us to bring in decent quality imports as there are sometimes players who come over to the UK and are expected to be good purely because they are Canadians
Whilst I can understand that view, I don't agree entirely. To understand why, we have to look at how we got here.

In the 80s and early 90s we had a situation where there were a handful of British players who were on par with imports - ie Tony hand and the Coopers. Where the Coopers went, trophies tended to follow. The best British players were apparently getting paid more than some imports. The ISL got rid off import limits, thus getting rid of the scarcity problem and leveling the playing field for all teams. It also allowed teams to move away from playing at most two lines, with some imports playing a full sixty minutes. If we went down to just 4 imports, you'd see a return to those problems and the overall standard would drop. I'm not sure it'd return after a few years.

I think the approach to get more Brits in the elite league is to require a minimum match night bench strength and have proper farm team arrangements rather than just having individuals on 2 way contracts.
 

Johnnybravo1927

Well-Known Member
#19
Whilst I can understand that view, I don't agree entirely. To understand why, we have to look at how we got here.

In the 80s and early 90s we had a situation where there were a handful of British players who were on par with imports - ie Tony hand and the Coopers. Where the Coopers went, trophies tended to follow. The best British players were apparently getting paid more than some imports. The ISL got rid off import limits, thus getting rid of the scarcity problem and leveling the playing field for all teams. It also allowed teams to move away from playing at most two lines, with some imports playing a full sixty minutes. If we went down to just 4 imports, you'd see a return to those problems and the overall standard would drop. I'm not sure it'd return after a few years.

I think the approach to get more Brits in the elite league is to require a minimum match night bench strength and have proper farm team arrangements rather than just having individuals on 2 way contracts.

You make a valid point. Personally ( I am no expert) I think dropping to 4 imports would work. The situation with the Coopers isn't an issue right now as there are no Brita that are that much better than all the others. I may be biased as I have a son who plays junior hockey and realistically there is virtually zero chance of him playing pro hockey and this applies to nearly all the kids. The standard is now so high that it's impossible to break the circle. Then as the standard is so high, very little money ( if any) gets invested in youth hockey. The money is instead spent on imports who require a decent wage ( which I fully understand). It's a vicious circle really. I also think that the GB team would improve over time. I will say that Manchester Storm are working a lot with their youth academy and in several years it will bear fruit
 

moggy#9

Well-Known Member
Thread starter #20
You make a valid point. Personally ( I am no expert) I think dropping to 4 imports would work. The situation with the Coopers isn't an issue right now as there are no Brita that are that much better than all the others. I may be biased as I have a son who plays junior hockey and realistically there is virtually zero chance of him playing pro hockey and this applies to nearly all the kids. The standard is now so high that it's impossible to break the circle. Then as the standard is so high, very little money ( if any) gets invested in youth hockey. The money is instead spent on imports who require a decent wage ( which I fully understand). It's a vicious circle really. I also think that the GB team would improve over time. I will say that Manchester Storm are working a lot with their youth academy and in several years it will bear fruit
Yes, I'm sympathetic the the position of kids. I think that the farm team path would be beneficial as I don't see two ways working as an effective path at the moment. Whatever the solution I think that there needs to be an effective development path.
 
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