do something about it!!

[TheStub]

Personally, I wont be attending games next season. It is a small thing for me, I live too far to attend anyway - but that is the only sanction anyone has, stay away.

Standing outside with placards will not help - the man has an ego to rival Maggie. So just bleed the club to death.

If the building is empty, and no-one buys any merch, there is no team. We don't have a massive secondary income stream, survival is based on the gates. So let the team die a financial death. See what Ragan does then. But you have to be willing to let the club die, and take all the IP with it.

If you want to make a protest, every week send Paul a personal letter telling him why you haven't gone to the game, and what you hope to see. Getting 2000 letters a week instead of 2000 paying customers will make a statement no amount of shouting would make.

 

[Mooney#16]

Whilst everyone would love the Devils to remain the Brand loyalty to that name is not strong enough the lose of the IP is any sort of chip in the game. The only chip is his eliteleague membership as ratified by the board of owners. If he goes down that is lost and it's a straight up new franchise. I can't see him stomaching a couple hundred thousand pound lose somehow. He needs a return on his franchise. For me it's not if. It's when and for how much.

 

[mazza03]

the annoying thing is people will still go and watch them!
And as long as people do Ragan is happy with some kind of income.

I for one have renewed my ST but deeply regret it at the moment, I love hockey but feel that I don't want to go next season, it's a Catch 22 situation, I was one of the ones that was outside "THAT YEAR" and feel we are maybe heading for another one. WD

I only renewed mine because my daughter wanted to renew. WD

 

[Sliput]

I'm not sure that the rot stops in Cardiff. The league is so badly organised that we are just seeing the results surface whilst we are in the wilderness. It was a season from hell, and that is the result of many chickens coming home to roost for the ownership - with many people who had been on the inside suddenly being on the outside with an axe to grind. It was a death spiral with dirty washing being aired in public, reducing income and further pushing owners into a poor position.

If the same thing happened with other clubs would we see the same things?

There are no mechanisms to censure the clubs. No requirements for transparent contracts. No requirements to protect players.

All the fans can do is stay away and force the club to go under. Make it financially untenable for it to continue - but that will damage the club. Are we willing to go there?

We have Ragan. We may have to deal with that for the time being. What is needed is a mediated solution. I doubt you'll see that, but that will be the only way to see this to a nicer conclusion.

I think there is no chance of mediation because that requires a certain amount of trust, the owners/management have told so many lies that, hopefully no one believes a word they say again

I agree with you but my problem is that i dont trust some of the people behind trying to get Ragan out either. (I do not mean any of the CDRA). Some of them have shown that they will turn when it suits them and their true intentions also worry me.

 

[ASHIPP]

I too wouldn't be suprised if something is going on in the background.....receivers or potential new ownership.

PR has not only destroyed the good name of our fantastic club but at the same time has damaged his own reputation and exposed his business practices (at least at the Devils).

His first prioriety will be damage limitation, protect his other assets and restore his credibilty. He can't do that at the Devils.....everything has gone too far publically for reconciliation. There is only one realistic and respectable course of action.

 

[Burgy]

the annoying thing is people will still go and watch them!
And aslong as people do ragan is happy with some kind of income.

Not sure about that as many long term fans have not renewed and will not be going whilst hes here still.The impact will be huge next season and whatever BS is spun season tickets must be massively down.

Didnt get any money out of me last season due to his actions and wont get any out of me in the coming Season if he is still part of the Devils.

I would rather travel to an away game and give my money to that team than to his pocket

 

[ASHIPP]

the annoying thing is people will still go and watch them!
And as long as people do Ragan is happy with some kind of income.

I for one have renewed my ST but deeply regret it at the moment, I love hockey but feel that I don't want to go next season, it's a Catch 22 situation, I was one of the ones that was outside "THAT YEAR" and feel we are maybe heading for another one. WD

I only renewed mine because my daughter wanted to renew. WD

Sadly you are not alone. Many people like us have already paid in full. Luckily for my Father he was able to stop his DD v quickly. How sad for a man of 78 who has supported the Club since 1986.

Would love a statement reassuring us that our hard earned money on season tickets will definitely be spent on next season's team. The lack of credible information coming out of the club right now suggests a lot to me.

 

[DevilDom]

Has anybody been able to get through to the Devils office today?

 

[Wannabe2]

Which branch, Cardiff, Newport, or the outer Hebrides.

 

[jodysstillagirlsname]

I agree with you but my problem is that i dont trust some of the people behind trying to get Ragan out either. (I do not mean any of the CDRA). Some of them have shown that they will turn when it suits them and their true intentions also worry me.

I fail to see how Ragan can continue at the helm of the club

I made no secret of wanting Ragan out, there is no agenda or personal gain for me other than to see my club run properly and the satisfaction of seeing the new rink be completed, for which I have campaigned as vice chair of SORAC since 2005. It will be a relief that someone as dodgy as Ragan will not profit from all of the efforts of everyone involved over that time, that includes all of the people who have been on the committee, Cardiff City Council and all that have supported the protests

 

[Welshy74]

the annoying thing is people will still go and watch them!
And as long as people do Ragan is happy with some kind of income.

I for one have renewed my ST but deeply regret it at the moment, I love hockey but feel that I don't want to go next season, it's a Catch 22 situation, I was one of the ones that was outside "THAT YEAR" and feel we are maybe heading for another one. WD

I only renewed mine because my daughter wanted to renew. WD

Sadly you are not alone. Many people like us have already paid in full. Luckily for my Father he was able to stop his DD v quickly. How sad for a man of 78 who has supported the Club since 1986.

Would love a statement reassuring us that our hard earned money on season tickets will definitely be spent on next season's team. The lack of credible information coming out of the club right now suggests a lot to me.

Has he had any comeback from the Devils or FF about cancelling the DD?

 

[Diafol]

I'm pretty much with Mazza and ASHIPP on this one.

I've said in the past on here that I was neither for or against "the militia", but there did seem to be a fair bit of "I know something you don't know" about certain posters during last season. That meant that I took both pro and anti-Ragan opinions with a large pinch of salt.

I've been a ST holder for about 10 years, and in all honesty didn't want to give up my "fix", so signed up for the DD scheme before the revelations came to light. More fool me then, or so it seems.

I feel for the players who have been unfairly treated and are owed money, but feel just as deeply for us fans who seem to be in the same boat.

What happens now I wonder ? Maybe I'm reading too much into this but...

Assuming there will be a "Cardiff Devils" team to watch next season with a purchased ST, would anyone who chooses to attend to try and recoup their hard-earned money's worth be classed as "siding with the enemy" ? Is that part of the master plan, to turn supporters against each other ?

On the other hand, we could all just end up as part of a long list of creditors...

These are sad times indeed

 

[ASHIPP]

Welshy - consult your bank if you have concerns about smallprint. Remember YOU are the customer. You can cancel a DD with a justifiable reason. My Dad consulted his bank manager before going ahead. Can't speak for any payments you may already have made.

 

[Diafol]

The "small print" taken from the DD form states:

"The completion and acceptance of this application form binds me to complete the payments to Future Financials for the entire period of the season ticket."

Which could probably mean we're stuffed.

However, the "Direct Debit Guarantee" leaflet produced by BACS states:

"Can I cancel a Direct Debit?
Yes – simply by writing to your bank or building society. It is a
good idea to also send a copy to the company concerned.
Your bank or building society can make the cancellation up
to and including the due date, but try not to leave it until the
last minute or you run the risk of a payment being made.
Remember that cancelling the Direct Debit simply stops paying
the company. If you carry on receiving the goods or services
then you will have to organise an alternative payment method."

Does that mean that as we haven't yet received any goods or services, we can cancel the DD after all without any comebacks ?

 

[toy_car_uk]

The "small print" taken from the DD form states:

"The completion and acceptance of this application form binds me to complete the payments to Future Financials for the entire period of the season ticket."

Which could probably mean we're stuffed.

However, the "Direct Debit Guarantee" leaflet produced by BACS states:

"Can I cancel a Direct Debit?
Yes – simply by writing to your bank or building society. It is a
good idea to also send a copy to the company concerned.
Your bank or building society can make the cancellation up
to and including the due date, but try not to leave it until the
last minute or you run the risk of a payment being made.
Remember that cancelling the Direct Debit simply stops paying
the company. If you carry on receiving the goods or services
then you will have to organise an alternative payment method."

Does that mean that as we haven't yet received any goods or services, we can cancel the DD after all without any comebacks ?

It's grey, If it is seen as FF are providing a service to you, in that they have paid CD in full for a season ticket on your behalf and you are paying FF in instalments for that service, then FF have upheld their side. You are expected to uphold your side with FF regardless of what the CD do (based on the small print). The DD can be cancelled at any time, that does not automatic mean your debt to FF will be cleared. You would also need to consider the impact it could have on your credit rating (Google Richard Durkin). To find out what your options are and the legalities of it all you really should look to get help from a specialist. The Citizens Advice Bureau would be where I would start, others have suggested Trading Standards or FCA.

 

[Sliput]

I agree with you but my problem is that i dont trust some of the people behind trying to get Ragan out either. (I do not mean any of the CDRA). Some of them have shown that they will turn when it suits them and their true intentions also worry me.

I fail to see how Ragan can continue at the helm of the club

I made no secret of wanting Ragan out, there is no agenda or personal gain for me other than to see my club run properly and the satisfaction of seeing the new rink be completed, for which I have campaigned as vice chair of SORAC since 2005. It will be a relief that someone as dodgy as Ragan will not profit from all of the efforts of everyone involved over that time, that includes all of the people who have been on the committee, Cardiff City Council and all that have supported the protests

Have i said Ragan should remain ??

 

[jodysstillagirlsname]

I'm pretty much with Mazza and ASHIPP on this one.

I've said in the past on here that I was neither for or against "the militia", but there did seem to be a fair bit of "I know something you don't know" about certain posters during last season. That meant that I took both pro and anti-Ragan opinions with a large pinch of salt.

I've been a ST holder for about 10 years, and in all honesty didn't want to give up my "fix", so signed up for the DD scheme before the revelations came to light. More fool me then, or so it seems.

I feel for the players who have been unfairly treated and are owed money, but feel just as deeply for us fans who seem to be in the same boat.

What happens now I wonder ? Maybe I'm reading too much into this but...

Assuming there will be a "Cardiff Devils" team to watch next season with a purchased ST, would anyone who chooses to attend to try and recoup their hard-earned money's worth be classed as "siding with the enemy" ? Is that part of the master plan, to turn supporters against each other ?

On the other hand, we could all just end up as part of a long list of creditors...

These are sad times indeed

As you can see from Dan's statement Ragan went to great lengths and used bullying tactics to gag the players ( employees ) because of this things had to be posted as 'rumour' to protect their positions. It most definitely wasn't meant to come over as any 'I know something you don,t know' but it is a difficult line to tread.

The #waitandsee hopefully saved some from being in the position that you find yourself in, and I have every sympathy with those that have signed up with Future Financials.

The thing I have learned is that most rumours in hockey have some truth in them, but the ones spread by word of mouth tend to get exagerrated as they spread so caution is needed

I wish you all the best of luck in getting what you have paid for

 

[jodysstillagirlsname]

I agree with you but my problem is that i dont trust some of the people behind trying to get Ragan out either. (I do not mean any of the CDRA). Some of them have shown that they will turn when it suits them and their true intentions also worry me.

I fail to see how Ragan can continue at the helm of the club

I made no secret of wanting Ragan out, there is no agenda or personal gain for me other than to see my club run properly and the satisfaction of seeing the new rink be completed, for which I have campaigned as vice chair of SORAC since 2005. It will be a relief that someone as dodgy as Ragan will not profit from all of the efforts of everyone involved over that time, that includes all of the people who have been on the committee, Cardiff City Council and all that have supported the protests

Have i said Ragan should remain ??

No but you are equally concerned about any prospective new management, wasn't having a dig by the way

 

[chillee]

It's grey, If it is seen as FF are providing a service to you, in that they have paid CD in full for a season ticket on your behalf and you are paying FF in instalments for that service, then FF have upheld their side. You are expected to uphold your side with FF regardless of what the CD do (based on the small print). The DD can be cancelled at any time, that does not automatic mean your debt to FF will be cleared. You would also need to consider the impact it could have on your credit rating (Google Richard Durkin). To find out what your options are and the legalities of it all you really should look to get help from a specialist. The Citizens Advice Bureau would be where I would start, others have suggested Trading Standards or FCA.

This is the worst piece.

No 5 FFL shall not be liable to the season ticket holder for any act, omission or default of Cardiff Ice Arena Ltd.

Basically, no Ice Hockey, not Future Financials problem, please continue to pay or we will implement this.

No 3 FFL shall include its successors and assigns.

Basically it will be sold to a debt collection agency for collection. You'll receive numeerous calls and letters daily and your credit score will go through the floor.

The most important piece is next to your signature box.

The completion and acceptance of this application form binds me to complete the payments to Future Financials for the entire period of the season ticket.

Ochh that is a nasty piece of terms & conditions.

Although unless there are further terms set out on the reverse of the document, you could challenge the validity of the contract due to unfair terms and conditions legislation, as all terms and conditions have to be fair to both parties, you could argue that since FF are simply collecting on behalf of Ragan, their risk/loss should be Ragans, not you and because you have not received anything or a percentage of games, why should you be liable for the whole amount.

You'll need advice.