2017/2018 Rumours & Offseason nonsense

OK I'll bite.... I think this question recalls the famous 'what did the Romans do for us' sketch..... so apart from numerous bone crunching hits, some of the most skilled penalty killing I have seen, being part of a team that won three (and so very nearly four) trophies, intimidating numerous D Men into coughing up the puck and by all accounts being a key person in helping with team cohesion..... maybe not much.....

Sorry, just don't understand the culture of criticism without evidence. It was not his job alone to sort out any misdemeanours and although there were moments when I would have liked him to do more.... there were also plenty of moments when he turned momentum with one shift.
I genuinely didnt post to get a bite, thats a bit troll like and not really my style. I apologise if it came across like that.
I get your point and he did play a part but a small part in comparison to his earnings and reputation. As I said before, his hitting was good but not a whole lot better than others and he played well on a penalty kill unit but so did the other 3 in the unit. Towards the end of the season he looked a lot less interested and particuarly when we played Giants and Nickerson criss checked Joey Haddad in front of Bordeleau and he did nothing. I saw a big reputation, a popular figure with the fans but overall I was unimpressed. He struggled against Klotz ( who in fairness is tough) and beat Keefe who is a foot shorter. Maybe my expectations were too high but I expected more and I think that its no coincedence he obviously isnt coming back. To be fair I also thought McGrattan was poor despite several fights. The best in that role I have seen in recent years was Cam Jannsen.
 

kettdevil1

Well-Known Member
I genuinely didnt post to get a bite, thats a bit troll like and not really my style. I apologise if it came across like that.
I get your point and he did play a part but a small part in comparison to his earnings and reputation. As I said before, his hitting was good but not a whole lot better than others and he played well on a penalty kill unit but so did the other 3 in the unit. Towards the end of the season he looked a lot less interested and particuarly when we played Giants and Nickerson criss checked Joey Haddad in front of Bordeleau and he did nothing. I saw a big reputation, a popular figure with the fans but overall I was unimpressed. He struggled against Klotz ( who in fairness is tough) and beat Keefe who is a foot shorter. Maybe my expectations were too high but I expected more and I think that its no coincedence he obviously isnt coming back. To be fair I also thought McGrattan was poor despite several fights. The best in that role I have seen in recent years was Cam Jannsen.
I think the key point is about expectations..... and on that I agree 100%. Frankly I think Gretzky, Lemieux or Crosby would have struggled to live up to the hype before he arrived.... he wasn't the Messiah but what I thought he did well was cast an air of uncertainty onto the ice. Players were nervous when he was around and although he didn't always react in the way I expected, I was FAR happier having him playing for us then against us and certainly happier then if we had signed Klotz, Nickerson, McGrattan or plenty others I could name.
 

Wagstaff

Well-Known Member
Different opinions I guess but I have never been convinced by Marquadt, he went missing far too often whenever I watched the Blaze and unlike Faryna (who I think would be a great fit for us) he never seemed to have the team at the centre of everything he did....
I think you are right there, But then most of our team seemed to coast for most of the season, Marquardt had some fleeting moments and protected the cousins from the rough stuff, but I can only think of two times he actually fought anyone
 

Ocko

Well-Known Member
Anyone that wants us to sign a player who can out up decent points but still be tough need to remember the role they are going to be expected to play. You aren't going to get someone like Desbians to come and play on the 4th line; have 4th line minutes (including times when the bench is shortened), play PK with no PP time. It isn't going to happen. Bordealeu and Brine were happy with those roles because they've made a career out of the bottom 6, but a Marquadt, Salters, Desbians type player want top line minutes which is something we can't give them.
 

mazza03

Well-Known Member
What exacy did Bordeleau do for us? Some big hits here and there but plenty of opposition players took liberties and he didnt react. I thought he was a waste of money and will be pleased to see him replaced by someone cheaper, younger and more interested
People seem to forget that this guy could actually skate, play hockey and put the puck in the net, good on the PK and PP, I would have him back in a heart beat.
 

ASHIPP

Well-Known Member
Anyone that wants us to sign a player who can out up decent points but still be tough need to remember the role they are going to be expected to play. You aren't going to get someone like Desbians to come and play on the 4th line; have 4th line minutes (including times when the bench is shortened), play PK with no PP time. It isn't going to happen. Bordealeu and Brine were happy with those roles because they've made a career out of the bottom 6, but a Marquadt, Salters, Desbians type player want top line minutes which is something we can't give them.

We have no idea what Lordo is going to do with the lines next season.......because we don't know which players will be on the roster. It is perfectly feasible that the Devils COULD give top 1st/2nd line minutes to a Marquardt/Desbiens/Salters type player coming in.....if Lordo decides to re-juggle the lines, or even decides to move himself - he can play any forward role you can think of on any line. It's as much about chemistry as it is playing a role. And Desbiens didn't spend all his time on the top lines at Steelers.
 

Slartibartfast

Well-Known Member
People seem to forget that this guy could actually skate, play hockey and put the puck in the net, good on the PK and PP, I would have him back in a heart beat.
I think the reason some people were disappointed in Bordy is because of the high standard we have come to expect from ex NHL players. Just looking at Hockey DB you can see the difference

Craig Weller 50 points in 39 games
Paul Bissonnette 19 points in 10 games
Patrick Bordeleau 10 points in 49 games

Yes Bordy was a good deterrent but so were Biz and Weller and they produced a lot more points wise. Maybe we have just been spoilt in the past and may never get the likes of Weller or Biz again.
 
I think the reason some people were disappointed in Bordy is because of the high standard we have come to expect from ex NHL players. Just looking at Hockey DB you can see the difference

Craig Weller 50 points in 39 games
Paul Bissonnette 19 points in 10 games
Patrick Bordeleau 10 points in 49 games

Yes Bordy was a good deterrent but so were Biz and Weller and they produced a lot more points wise. Maybe we have just been spoilt in the past and may never get the likes of Weller or Biz again.
This is a good point, although import limits were lower in the days of Weller and Biz. I'm pretty sure the limit was 10 in Weller's season so squads just weren't as deep and ex-NHL players stood out that much more. My memories of Weller are very very good indeed, he left a longer lasting impression than Biz and then more so again than Bordelau, but it's difficult to compare the three as they weren't playing on level terms.
 
This is a good point, although import limits were lower in the days of Weller and Biz. I'm pretty sure the limit was 10 in Weller's season so squads just weren't as deep and ex-NHL players stood out that much more. My memories of Weller are very very good indeed, he left a longer lasting impression than Biz and then more so again than Bordelau, but it's difficult to compare the three as they weren't playing on level terms.
Just out of interest, would anyone choose Bordeleau over Bissonnette?
 
A tough question to answer! Primarily because we didn't see much of Bissonnette's physical side when he was over here. He was used very differently as the go to guy and it's difficult to compare him with Bordelau as the two played such different roles on the respective teams. Loved everything Bissonnette brought to the squad though and I'd say he was a slightly more rounded player who could also fight, so for me Biz just edges it.
 

Devil_Abroad

Well-Known Member
I think the reason some people were disappointed in Bordy is because of the high standard we have come to expect from ex NHL players. Just looking at Hockey DB you can see the difference

Craig Weller 50 points in 39 games
Paul Bissonnette 19 points in 10 games
Patrick Bordeleau 10 points in 49 games

Yes Bordy was a good deterrent but so were Biz and Weller and they produced a lot more points wise. Maybe we have just been spoilt in the past and may never get the likes of Weller or Biz again.
Factor in the difference in league quality and which lines and roles they played. It isn't black and white.


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Gazza272

Well-Known Member
One thing to consider is just how important league games were this past season.

look at Voth's history with us, which year was his least penalised? 10/11! why? because we were chasing a league title and had a very very good go of it. voth couldn't be as reckless as he was in other seasons, which saw him stick up for his team mates at times to the detriment of the result, but when you are a 4th place team that doesn't matter so much. But Voth like Bordy, knew that it's sometimes more important to swollow your enforcer pride for the good of the team when chasing honors.
 

Leighton

Active Member
But Voth like Bordy, knew that it's sometimes more important to swollow your enforcer pride for the good of the team when chasing honors.
Thats an interesting point (to me at least) on the role of a player like Voth/Bordy... Would you rather win the league with other teams taking liberties that go unpunished or hit seven bells out of anyone who puts a stick wrong and finish 4th?
 

Gospel

Active Member
If it wasn't for our own owner rescuing Shuff we would have won the league with Weller. That was a special team and deserved far more than they got.

For me I would take a Weller over a Biz or Bordy any day. The guy just had pure class and skated with such ease and nobody challenged him at all. If Weller was in last years team he would have looked even better.
 

ASHIPP

Well-Known Member
Thats an interesting point (to me at least) on the role of a player like Voth/Bordy... Would you rather win the league with other teams taking liberties that go unpunished or hit seven bells out of anyone who puts a stick wrong and finish 4th?
It is not as black and white as that - a 'blanket' decision can't be made across all games to beat the **** out of the opposition! Otherwise we'd have bench clearances in every game as soon as any misdemeanour was commited! Most of our guys were tough enough to handle persistant irritation or handbags without it escalating last season. Having a gigantic, skating deterrent like Bordy on the roster certainly helped keep the other teams quiet at times. But games were so tight last season (one goal deciding many, many results) what can the Coach decide to do? A tough call to dampen down retribution for the sake of securing the result and the points on the board.

Very serious misdemeanours such as running the goalie (happened to several goalies a few times last season) however should be dealt with immediately/confidently by the referee, with the full backing of DOPs - because a lengthy ban on an offending player is far more damaging to their team than facing any physical retribution from opposition players. This should be non-negotiable.
 
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Devil_Abroad

Well-Known Member
Thats an interesting point (to me at least) on the role of a player like Voth/Bordy... Would you rather win the league with other teams taking liberties that go unpunished or hit seven bells out of anyone who puts a stick wrong and finish 4th?
Win the league - always. The guys can just smile back at Armstrong and show him their medals.


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bb1

Well-Known Member
If it wasn't for our own owner rescuing Shuff we would have won the league with Weller. That was a special team and deserved far more than they got.

For me I would take a Weller over a Biz or Bordy any day. The guy just had pure class and skated with such ease and nobody challenged him at all. If Weller was in last years team he would have looked even better.
Completely agree. Weller is arguably the best player we have ever had in EIHL. He had it all. Even at Matzka game he showed how he still skates better than anybody we have seen over here. Just ask a 20st Brad Voth who threw at hit on him and bounced off
 
I think the key point is about expectations..... and on that I agree 100%. Frankly I think Gretzky, Lemieux or Crosby would have struggled to live up to the hype before he arrived.... he wasn't the Messiah but what I thought he did well was cast an air of uncertainty onto the ice. Players were nervous when he was around and although he didn't always react in the way I expected, I was FAR happier having him playing for us then against us and certainly happier then if we had signed Klotz, Nickerson, McGrattan or plenty others I could name.
I think the key point is about expectations..... and on that I agree 100%. Frankly I think Gretzky, Lemieux or Crosby would have struggled to live up to the hype before he arrived.... he wasn't the Messiah but what I thought he did well was cast an air of uncertainty onto the ice. Players were nervous when he was around and although he didn't always react in the way I expected, I was FAR happier having him playing for us then against us and certainly happier then if we had signed Klotz, Nickerson, McGrattan or plenty others I could name.
He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy
 

Temme

Well-Known Member
Completely agree. Weller is arguably the best player we have ever had in EIHL. He had it all. Even at Matzka game he showed how he still skates better than anybody we have seen over here. Just ask a 20st Brad Voth who threw at hit on him and bounced off
Albeit a 'rec' kind of game, Weller was phenomenal to watch in the Matchka!
 
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